Thanks a thousand to Phil Ball for the interview. It’s been a while since I’ve been meaning to interview Phil and at last we got round to do it. Hopefully soon we’ll be able to do an interview about The Rileys and why not, Feverfew. And talking about Feverfew, there will be news soon about a compilation of all their recorded output! Keep an eye on this same blog!

++ Hi Phil! At last we get to do an interview! How are things going? Lots of traveling from what I hear?

Hello Roque,
Yes, we do, finally.

It is my real pleasure, I appreciate you asking me. I hope that I do not disappoint. 🙂

Here we go then.

Actually all is good with me, thanks! These days it’s pretty crazy, I am extremely busy as always…

Yes you are correct. I do travel a lot through my work. I am a Project Manager and work for a large Japanese electronics manufacturer, in the automotive industry.

Later this week I will be away for four days visiting Continental Europe, including visits to Germany, Poland and Slovakia then back to the UK for the weekend. Then I will be out to the Czech Republic for another four days during the following week.

There are too many early starts and far too many late finishes, unfortunately.

I’m not complaining, I appreciate the opportunities that my work has given me. I am lucky to have had the possibility to visit countries that perhaps I would never have had the chance to visit, amongst others China, Thailand and of course Japan plus I currently spend a lot of time in Eastern Europe.

However I really need a rest now so I am looking forward to my summer vacation and spending time with my family, just a few weeks away now.

++ So, just in between Feverfew and The Rileys, there was Are You Mr. Riley?. That was in 1989, right? How long did this formation/band last? Who were in the band?

After feverfew dissolved (I am still not sure the band ever really split up, we just stopped doing “it”..) I was approached by a very drunken Mike Cottle (Local guitarist) at an Anti Apartheid gig I was promoting at Reading Trade Union club. I think this would have been around September’89

Mike “told” me that I should form a band with him, he knew of me through feverfew and You Can’t Be Loved Forever, and insisted, in an alcohol fuelled stupor, and that we should work together. He had a number of songs and ideas which he wanted to progress and believed that I was the person that could help him develop them.

I just took this approach with a pinch of salt, a crazy drunken ramble, and did not expect to hear anymore.

Some days after this event I received a very nice letter from Mike apologising profusely for his drunken approach. .I took the plunge, phoned him, found we had lots of influences and ideas in common and we went from there.

We jammed around some of Mike’s ideas, decided it was workable and then went about forming the band. Vicky and Lloyd (feverfew vocalist and drummer respectively) were not playing at the time so I asked them come on-board.

Mike had a friend (Richard) who was also interested but had never sung in a band before and within a matter of weeks the band line up was in place and “Are you Mr. Riley?” was formed. This would have been around Oct’89

Some weeks later the line up was reinforced by Jason on guitar (also one time feverfew guitarist and my very close friend) and the band went from strength to strength. As you know the first demo songs were recorded December’89.

++ What was the main differences between this band and Feverfew and The Rileys?

Well, Are you Mr. Riley very soon became “The Rileys” as we got fed up with the “Which one is Mr. Riley then? Quips. People would walk away believing they had made the best joke ever, all we would do is grimace and want to punch them in the face (numerous times)….

Also The Rileys, as a name, seemed snappier and more appropriate (I guess the mould was made by another indie band with a surname as a band name…)

Therefore I guess the question to answer is “What was the difference between The Rileys and Feverfew?”

I remember reading a live review for feverfew that stated that feverfew was “uncompromisingly fragile” I guess this was a true reflection of the band based on the vision and genius of Keith and Paul and would be further explored and developed through their activities as Blueboy. Feverfew was generally mis-understood, shyness perceived as arrogance.

The Rileys were generally more upbeat and openly optimistic, punchier more raucous guitar pop, hearts worn on our sleeves (not sure if we were ever Indiepop..). The Rileys were essentially a live band that was where the main energy and drive came from. However our motivation, ideals and influences were not so different from those of feverfew, just the method of delivery.

++ Where does the name come from?

I would like to say it was the title of some obscure cult movie from the 1960’s or a line from a cool song / band, however the reality and truth of the matter is that the background is very un-cool.

Are you Mr. Riley is the name of a song which was sang by groups of girl guides around campfires…

I should try to explain….
The hall where we used to rehearse was also used by Girl Guides and Brownie troops, one day whilst we were tidying up (not very rock and roll behaviour I know) we found a songbook called “Songs for Elfins” and inside next to the classic “She’ll be coming round the mountain when she comes” was a song called “Are you Mr. Riley”.

As the band had no name at that time it just kind of stuck and was adopted as the band name.

++ Did you play many gigs under this name? Any gigs in particular that you remember?

Yes quite a few but mainly in and around the local Reading area including one with Strawberry Story which was particularly good however things really started to take off after the change of name to “The Rileys”

As The Rileys we played many, many gigs including those on the university and college circuit including supporting The Buzzcocks, Carter USM, The Rain etc as well as our own headline gigs… The Rileys at that time were growing as a band and were starting to attract a regular live audience. Very soon we were being managed by Wayne who in his daily job was the accountant for Rough Trade records, this opened many doors for us.

++ I was wondering, why didn’t Keith Girdler join the band? He did help record the “Go On – Spoil Yourself” demo, right?

Actually no, Keith (and also Paul Blueboy) did not participate in the recording of “Go on, spoil yourself”. They were not part of The Rileys line up and not really involved in writing and performing with the band, however four of the band were actually ex-feverfew members. (I say not really however they were involved for the recording of the Happiness EP, this is where the confusion starts, more on this later…)

One of the reasons that feverfew ceased to exist, apart from the general apathy and negativity towards the band at the time, was that Keith had a new partner and was generally spending less of his time in Reading and more in Brighton. Around this time Paul was going steady plus I was in the process of getting married so our priorities just changed and the band became less important.

This meant that the gap between band rehearsals became wider and wider up until the point that they just did not happen anymore. By the time of my wedding in July’89 we were all still friends but no longer a band..

So by Autumn’89 I and the other feverfew members had time on our hands and when the chance came to form “Are you Mr. Riley?” everybody jumped at the opportunity, this line up lasted until late 1990, basically the line up consisted of the four members of feverfew, Phil (Bass), Llloyd (Drums), Vicky (vocals) and Jason (Guitar), that were not Paul and Keith plus two friends Mike (Guitar) and Richard (Vocals).

I also had the idea for, and started working on You Can’t Be Loved Forever around this timing, Paul and Keith started working and writing songs together on an ad-hoc basis due to Keith spending more of his time in Brighton plus Paul was working with a new band “She’s Gone”. Clear Skies from the first Blueboy album was actually a song written with “She’s Gone” (You can find the original version on YCBLF No. 3)

Keith was always very supportive of “Are you Mr. Riley / The Rileys” and would regularly write to me and the others with words of encouragement and support plus he provided a great deal of advice for the band..

Going back to your original question(s). I can understand your comments and why you may have thought Keith was part of The Rileys. It is a little confusing as the relationship between feverfew, The Rileys and also Blueboy over the life of the bands was quite incestuous.

In April ’91 Paul played guitar and Keith sang backing vocals on the two Rileys tracks of the “Happiness EP” however they were never members of The Rileys.

Both The Rileys and feverfew joined together to play a joint/split gig at the Reading After Dark Club in Feb’91, this then extended to the idea for the recording session and finally the release of the Happiness EP on a Turntable Friend records.

Around this time the band (feverfew) was actually very close to reforming, united in grief for Jason who died in Jan ’91, it was a friendship rekindled and was a time of high creativity borne out of an extremely tragic event.

If you look at the band line ups all three bands have included many of the same band members Some examples:- Lloyd was drummer in feverfew, The Rileys and Blueboy, when Lloyd left Blueboy he was replaced by Martin Rose who was The Rileys drummer but also played with Blueboy part time.

Cath Close who replaced Vicky as female vocalist in The Rileys also later sang with Blueboy.

Also Keith included the acoustic version of “I can wait” as part of a compilation LP that was released on his Porrits Hill record.

++ Were those 4 songs on that demo the only songs you recorded?

No actually this line up of Are you Mr. Riley / The Rileys made two recording sessions, the four tracks on “Go on, spoil yourself” which was released on the YCBLF imprint plus a second session which included Ophelia’s Days and an instrumental called “Funky”.

“Ophelia’s days” was included on the “5, 4, 3, 2, 1, We have lift off” joint flexi with Home & Abroad,

You can also find many of the tracks on various compilation tapes including Grimsby Fishmarket. Both tracks from the second recording session were also included on YCBLF no.2

++ So the cassette cover, Elvis Presley. Are you a big fan?

Yes absolutely, I am a fan but I would not classify myself as a massive fan. I always remember the Elvis songs and also the movies as being part of my childhood.

The young Elvis was also extremely cool and iconic….

++ Would it be much to ask if you tell me a bit about each of the tracks on that demo?

Yes of course, but remember the songs are from ‘89:-

Barriers of mine – a lament to the Conservative government and the constant string of broken promises and lost opportunities (“How did you get there, I do not know. Some stupid people with no brains to go” / “Why did you do that you really messed it up, I’m crying for change but there’s just no luck” )

A song that is still relevant today based on the current UK political climate

I can wait – a song about unrequited love and the waiting, in vain, for a second chance (“The distance is measured by the heart and not by the yard”)

I’ll love you tomorrow – “I’ll love you tomorrow, but never today” a continuation of the theme from “I can wait”

++ “Recorded on The Refuge”. How did that go? Nice studio?

When you are a young band with little or no cash, is any studio nice? Unfortunately the lack of money does not give you a great deal of options. To coin a phrase “ You get what you pay for”

All joking aside, actually “The Refuge” was not bad, many of the Reading bands of the time “Pumpkin Fairies, Shelleys Children, Home & Abroad were recording there so the reputation of the recording engineer and studio was fairly high.

The general quality of recordings was pretty good and the cost was reasonable so overall, all things considered, the result was not too bad. The band were quite happy with this particular demo especially as the songs and also the band itself was still very new when this demo was recorded

++ I agree with you, Vicky’s voice is so underrated. I think it’s pretty special. Which song that she sings, in general, would you say it’s your favourite?

Actually many people underestimate or overlook the contribution that Vicky made to Feverfew as a band. If you listen to the feverfew recordings you will see (hear) that her backing vocals and harmonies really work well when entwined with Keith’s voice and really add “something” a bit special.

The Rileys was Vicky’s chance to shine as a singer rather than just being “the backing singer”, she constantly delivered great vocal performances both live and in the studio.

From my point of view I Can Wait is a personal favourite as is Time Will Pass, there are also two unreleased Rileys songs in particular “By Believing” and “Real Life” where the vocals are stunning.

The last vocal break on the Feverfew track “All the things I gave to you” always makes the hair on the back of my neck stand up. Whenever I hear this part of the song it takes me back to the first time I heard this in the studio, Vicky had been working with Keith to develop the vocals and harmonies. We had never heard this part of the song and Vicky recorded it in one take. Serendipity, just fantastic….

++ How was Reading back then? Did you have to go to London to see bands? Or would they come to your town too? What were the best places to hang out in Reading back then?

Reading was always (and still is) famous for the Annual August Bank Holiday music festival so I think that at least one time per year you had the chance to see some big names.

Other than that the chance to see a “good” band playing their own material was few and far between. Unfortunate it was quite easy to see very poor quality “Pub rock” bands though.

Around this 88 – 91 timing the number of venues was actually quite limited. The “Paradise” later “After Dark” Club was always good, I saw numerous “smaller” indie bands such as Brilliant Corners, Jim Jiminee, and Rhythm Sisters there.

The Top Rank (which historically was the main “mid-size” venue) became a bingo hall so the only chance to see “mid” size bands was at the Hexagon and also at the Majestic, I remember seeing The Stone Roses there back in the day….

There was good and bad for this, originally The Stone Roses were booked for the “After Dark” and feverfew were scheduled to support however the “Baggy / Madchester” scene was just gaining momentum subsequently this gig was then cancelled and some months later The Stone Roses played the Majestic (significantly bigger venue) with Sometimes Sartre and International Rescue in support. So we missed the opportunity of the “dream” support gig….

Reading University often put on bands, I saw The Smiths for the first time at the University.. I also saw Public Image Limited there. One of my claims to fame is being told by John Lydon “ You got what you want, now F*@K off!…

There were some smaller venues and hang outs such as The Purple Turtle, Cartoons and Ninos (the latter being an Italian restaurant that put on bands during the week) so the scene for local “Indiepop” bands at the time such as Sometimes Sartre, Pumpkin Fairies was OK but not great.

On a number of occasions there would be the need to go into London to see a band – every time I saw the Wedding Present it would involve a car journey into London….

++ And what about if I go as a tourist Phil? Is there anything worth visiting in Reading? Doesn’t seem that much of a touristy city, is it?

Historically Reading prospered based on the 3B’s, Bulbs, Biscuits and Beer however those days are long past and nothing in terms of these industries exists any longer

Reading is a town that has expanded as the property costs in London accelerated, due to the good train links to London it has become a “significant” commuter hub.

Not much to talk of in Reading in terms of a reason for visiting, you can no longer visit the old Abbey for example. However we do have a museum which is the only one in the world (I believe) to have a copy of the complete Bayeux Tapestry.

Other famous things, Oscar Wilde was imprisoned in Reading gaol and of course we have the annual Music festival. It is also the birth town of Ricky Gervais and Kate Winslett as well as the home of “Cemetery Junction” as immortalised in the recent film of the same name written by Ricky Gervais.

Unfortunately Reading now seems to be a place that people just pass through on the way to somewhere else…

++ Anyhow, so what happened, when did you all become The Rileys?

As advised previously “Are you Mr. Riley” very soon became “The Rileys”, the first incarnation of the band split in late 90.

The second line up of The Rileys was established after the recording of the Happiness EP in ‘91.

Just before Jason died in Jan’91 we were already working and writing new songs together and were joined by new guitarist / vocalist Simon Tarry with the intention of forming a new Rileys line up. “Time will pass” was written during these sessions and was the ever last song written with Jason

After Jason died, after a great deal of heart searching, Simon and I finally decided to carry on playing, recruited Cath Close, Martin Rose (later both Blueboy members) and some other friends. We wrote a brand new set with a newer “different” sound and subsequently recorded “Whirlygig” for Elefant Records.

++ Back then you were very involved with indiepop, releasing the fantastic compilation series “You Can’t Be Loved Forever”. Two questions. How did you get into this kind of music? And second, what made you do extra stuff? you were already in a band!

Mmm, interesting question and a difficult one to answer concisely.

For me it was just a natural progression. I first got into music through the discovery of punk and records back in 1977 when I was an 11 year old.

Luckily enough one of my friends brothers was one of the original “Punk Rockers” and used to have a cool and reasonably sized record collection. We would often go to his house and play all these great (and not so great..) records. This then led into a discovery of “Independent” record labels and many wondrous bands including Joy Division / Factory records, plus I started tuning into John Peel etc. The rest as they say is History….

Finally it lead me to pick up a bass guitar at the age of 17 and then start to play in bands.

YCBLF was conceived after I bought a compilation tape called “Rewind” at a gig (I think it was at one of the many Wedding Present gigs).

I liked the concept (It was the first time to see a good quality tape in terms of appearance, sound quality and the bands, and all at a reasonable price) and therefore thought it would be a good vehicle to promote the “good” bands from Reading and give them an opportunity to try and reach a broader audience.

So the idea was to mix bands / music from the Reading area with other “unknown” or lesser known but good bands and to promote the concept as an opportunity for people to discover some great new bands and for the bands themselves to reach a new and wider audience.

I think that effect of YCBLF was quite beneficial and helped to open up doors, I know that it had a positive impact for Feverfew and also for Home & Abroad and Shelleys Children..

From being in feverfew I could understand first hand the frustrations and limitations that many bands had and the obstacles they faced to promote and to try and get themselves heard. Therefore I wished to do something positive to pro-actively overcome the restrictions and create a new fan base and opportunity, it was a “win – win” situation.

At this time there was a fantastic “fanzine – do it yourself” culture so things expanded and developed very quickly with the network of bands, fanzines, record labels and compilation tapes.

There were many compilation tapes available but I used to get extremely frustrated due to the low quality recordings and the general lack of care and attention for the “product” so I made a conscious effort to ensure a good quality product at a reasonable price (The lesson learned from ”Rewind”).

Hopefully this answers your questions.

++ Oh! and yeah, how much work did it take to make those compilations? How long will it take to get all the songs together? And were there any fantastic bands that you would have loved to have on your tapes that for a reason or another they didn’t appear on them?

It would take a number of months to prepare the tapes, from the writing of letters requesting tracks, making the booklet through to the final production of the tape it would take 3 – 4 months.

I also use to master all the tracks onto DAT and then had the tapes “Professionally produced” at a duplication company to ensure “good quality” tapes. Generally I am pleased to state that the quality of the YCBLF tapes was to a higher level than many of its peers.

From what I can remember I do not believe than anybody turned down the opportunity / request, so basically I “got” everyone that I asked. I was especially pleased to have included Blue Summer, The Penny Candles, Greenhouse, Tramway and also the first recording of Chelsea Guitar (Paint me in blue) as part of the collection

++ Alright, one last question, can you cook Phil? What are your favourite dishes? It’s lunch time here in the US and I was hoping you’d inspire me…

I’m pretty hopeless in the kitchen, however I can make a stupendous spaghetti bolognaise and generally can follow a recipe with a reasonable result. Can I cook? Kind of…. You are always welcome to join!

++ Thanks again Phil! Anything else you’d like to add?

Thank you for the opportunity to do this, I hope my comments and reply is not a disappointment for you….

I really love what you are doing with the record label, fanzine and blog. People may not always like what you do and also what you say but at least you are trying to do “something” and trying to make a difference. Keep up the good work and keep believing in what you do!

Please also check my Youtube channel “bouncy66” there are lots of old Rileys, Feverfew and also Shelleys Children (I moonlighted on bass for a number of months) bibs and bobs there, enjoy!

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Listen
Are You Mr Riley? – I Can Wait

Thanks so much to Andy Ford for this great interview! Please don’t forget to get their newest album “Luminous Crocodile” which is the great comeback from this Liverpool classic band.  Ah! And become a fan here. Now sit back and enjoy!

++ Hellfire Sermons forms from the ashes of The Decemberists. What were the similarities and differences between these two bands?

Well Colin sang and played guitar and I was on bass in both bands so there was a lot of similarity as we had our own favourite sounds, but in Decemberists we had Andy Deevey on guitar who was more a Smiths/REM style than Neal’s Josef K/Velvet Underground style. Chris Harrison had a sort of jazz/light way of playing. In retrospect the fault of the Decemberists was that consciously or unconsciously we were looking for a record deal, and so we didn’t totally follow our inclinations. We went through an interesting phase where we
worked with a female co-vocalist called Karen Jones in the style of Alison Moyet. We picked up Del Amitri’s ex-manager who helped us to play a great support to James at the Pyramid
club in Liverpool.

The Decemberists hovered on the fringes of a major deal, but never quite got there! We had a residency at University of London, which was great exposure and we were promised a deal with WEA, which they reneged upon. This was quite a blow that let to us changing the name for the single. There are a lot of Decemberists songs which deserve a release – Simpler To Say, Just One Instant, There It Is, The Man Who Could see Through Everybody (all with Karen), then a more indie guitar sound when she left – James Is, Always Caught In The Rain, What Possessed You?, Gift Horse, Marble Room, and the original version of Rachel Clean.

++ I know about The Decemberists (which we should do an interview later!), but I really don’t have any idea at all of Chris Harrison’s previous bad, Jenny Lind. Can you tell me a
little bit about it?

Jenny Lind had Chris Harrison on drums (we stole him!), Neal Carr on guitar and vocals and Ken Nelson (later Coldplay’s producer) on guitar and vocals. They gigged with us and The Jactars, once supported the House Martins at a gig in a Liverpool strip club. They had some great songs – Suicide’s House, Spilt Milk and Christopher Columbus (which was about Ingrid Bergman in America). Ken would have to agree in order for them to be released.
Neal and I played before Decemberists and Jenny Lind in a band called ‘Swim Naked’ which was like sonic Youth before Sonic Youth, very raw and violent in places. In those days we
listened to Sister Ray by the Velvet Underground every day! That was about 1982-83

++ It was 1987 when you started as The Hellfire Sermons. How healthy was the scene in Liverpool? Years before I know there was a very interesting scene with The Lotus Eaters
and The Pale Fountains.

We were more part of a ‘scene’ from 1984 to 1987 when we practiced at Vulcan Studios down on the Dock Road with Jenny Lind. The Jactars, Half Man Half Biscuit, the DaVincis and others and we all helped each other with gigs and gear. We liked The Room, later Benny Profane but they rehearsed somewhere else. We used to go and see the Pale Fountains doing acoustic stuff in a bar on Mathew Street called the Left Bank, and they were really good. We continued playing with The Jactars over the years, then mainly with The Claim and Emily. Both were great.

++ First release was the Freakstorm 7″, one of my favourite Hellfire Sermons songs! It came out on a label called Hyme Records and received rave reviews especially from Bob Stanley. How did this single happened? How did you get the deal with this record label? What do you remember when recording your first ever single? Where you happy with the end result?

Freakstorm is really a Decemberists record released under a new name. Colin thought of the Hellfire name based on James Joyce that he was reading at the time. We had just been let down by WEA so we thought “Right, we’ll do it ourselves!”, it was really very difficult as we were all unemployed at the time, it was recorded in Rochdale with a lot of sacrifice at Barclay James Harvest’s studio starting in summer 1986, but only got finished on Christmas Eve after Colin had lost and regained his voice. We pressed 1,000 and sent them out on the indie distribution and waited…and waited…nothing happened – no reviews, nothing…Andy Deeevey and Chris got discouraged and moved to London, Neal joined us from Jenny Lind and we had just changed the name again, to the “Know Nots” when in summer 1988 Bob Stanley gave it a great review and we got offered gigs at universities and colleges – on condition we kept the name Hellfire Sermons! So we did. First gig was at Manchester Uni, no drummer, so Dave from The Claim played drums for us with no rehearsal.
Now the single sounds good, the original version was terrible as the Rochdale engineer mixed it in mono, so we got it redone at Strawberry Studios in Stockport (a lot of Joy Division was recorded there). Freakstorm always was a great song, Rachel Clean is a bit sweet for me.

++ The second single is released by the legendary Esurient Communications!! At the time of releasing HONEYMOON did you ever thought the releases on this label could become such sought for items? How did you meet Kevin Pearce? Were you fans at all of his fanzine?

Unknown to us a couple of Liverpool people had been writing to Kevin Pearce singing the praises of Decemberists, then he got in touch with one guy called Ian Rogers (later our manager) asking where are The Decemberists? The answer was “They are now the Hellfire Sermons!” Us being with Esurient meant we played more in London than Liverpool, you got press reviews and were part of a national scene. Kevin put on shows of Emily, The Claim, us and the unsigned Manic Street Preachers. In fact Richey Edwards used to write to us! Strange how things turn out. We had jobs by then and were now determined to stay ‘indie’ while the Manic Street Preachers moved to London and put the effort in to break into the major label scene. Kevin is a great guy, his purist views of music chimed with our anti-capitalist agenda, so it worked well. We had all been reading his fanzine, ‘Hungry Beat’. But we were still short of money – Honey/Moon and Quicksand and Penny-Pinching Cathy were recorded at Emily’s studio in Chester for about £250! And we had to record Not Nailed Down and Best Laugh in the middle of the night using time other bands had booked and not used. We did those up at Amazon in Kirkby which was used by China Crisis and the Bunnymen.

++ Talking about fanzines, how did fanzine writers embraced Hellfire Sermons? Your music is POP, but the guitar playing is very different from the jangle of that time. In a way it reminds more of early 80s post punk, Josef K or The Fire Engines. Did fanzine writers enjoyed that fact?

We were nearly always misunderstood by the indie crowd and music journalists as we did not like twee jangle, also we were older, and worked rather than being students, but there was a group of people around Kevin who were on our wavelength who wanted a bit more grot in their music. Then the Pixies happened and that opened up a good space for us. It is quite funny now to see the records sold as C86 artefacts!

++ Third single is the superb The Best Laugh I Ever Had and includes that amazing B-Side that is Not Nailed Down. One of the best singles of the era for sure! Esurient does make a risky move by releasing it at the same time as The Claim’s latest single. What repercussions did this bring to the band and the label?

It was a bold decision by Kevin, announcing a presence really – I don’t think it harmed sales as they were small pressings of 1,000 I think, and Kevin had terrible problems with distribution and especially getting paid for records sold in the shops. It was really a matter of the personal honesty of the shop owners! Pre-internet – no downloads, no e-distribution – it seems archaic now! So the records got good reviews and sold well but Esurient got barely enough money returned to do another! We never got any money, because there was no surplus. But we were just glad to be with Kevin’s label.

++ Next comes the Dishy label, with Guy Sirman running it. He offers to release a 500 run 7″ single. Covered in Love is the first reference on this label. The reviews were great! Was moving from label to label easy for you? What was the best moments of this period?

Well in a sense Guy reaped what Kevin had sown. He issued ‘Covered In Love’ and it got Single of the Week in Melody maker and instantly sold out. It really put Dishy on the map. But it was only a 500 pressing so not much money made again. We debated whether to re-press (which would have been the right decision) but it was down to money, so it was agreed to do another single which took about a year to record and release. That was Sarasine.

++ Why did Dishy didnt’ keep supporting you? Why did he went into support some dance acts?!

I really don’t know. After Sarasine we completed ‘Uncle Oliver’/’Cock O’Th’Street’ which were good songs but unexpectedly Guy said they weren’t what he wanted. I think if we had been in London seeing him more regularly he would have seen what we were doing, but by that time he was more supporting a band called Delta. So we accepted the blow and recorded an album. But when we had the demos again Guy was lukewarm, and it was never finally finished.

++ During this session you recorded 7 songs, what happened to the other 5 that weren’t released on the 7″?

The 7 were – Bill and Sarah, Two Faces, Callaghan, Covered With Love, Him Again, Sacred Skin, Real Life Seams. I think they all made it onto ‘Hymns Ancient and Modern’. So we recorded 7 songs in a day – back to the ways of the early Beatles! Again the whole thing cost about £300. WE picked the best two. But the mix on the last few suffered because we were so tired on the day. So Real Life Seams was much better than what you hear. We do have a good version recorded ready for release some day maybe.

++ 1994 and Dishy releases Sarasine. From that moment on the band seems to fall into obscurity. What happened? It’s quite surprising that a band with such quality songs kind of disappeared.

Yes indeed. We had issues in our lives – me, Neal and Colin had young children, my work was facing closure and I led a massive campaign in Liverpool to stop that happening. Colin was studying. But we did record the album for Dishy somehow, and between all the various versions we do have good recordings of Cock O’Th’Street, Uncle Oliver, I Won’t tell A Soul, Arthur’s Tongue, Beautiful World, Get Another Lover, Holy Joe, Nervous Girl, Pig, Headcase, Cod Fax, I’m Saved, Orderly Crocodile. Before we could finally mix it, Colin had to move away to get work and we had to change how we did the band.

++ Did you find that there was a big change in the guitar pop scene between those late eighties and early ninenties?

The whole indie scene was dying down and becoming more corporate – the music press, venues, radio, fanzines were all becoming corporate or just closing– and yet the internet – downloads, blogs – had not yet really happened. I would say it became much more difficult to find your audience without mass media access. Paradoxically, from about 2001 things improved as the internet came in – the bar to being allowed to put your music out is far lower now and we actually make more money back on the recordings now than we did in the 1990s! Not much though – it all goes back to fund releases like ‘Luminous Crocodile’

++ What about gigging? Did you gig much at all? Is there any particular gig that you remember?

We giiged loads as Decemberists, and actually built a local following. As Hellfire sermons we gigged a lot in London and got those music paper reviews, but only occasionally played
in Liverpool, so HFS had more of a national profile, less so in our hometown! Now we don’t play gigs much – not sure who they reach, but who knows – it is good for a band to play –
but we want the right audience, and let’s face it – we are obscure!! Good, but still obscure. The gig I remember is the one in London for Kevin – we were on form – and as we played it was as if we had hypnotised the audience – they responded to each note and drum roll. Magical.

++ Hymns: Ancient and Modern was released in 2002. I don’t remember seeing that much promotion of it, or anything, but nowadays it’s not that easy to come by with a copy! How did Bus Stop approach you to release this retrospective LP? Why did you decided to put it out? Do you feel it was like closing a chapter?

It got a very good set of reviews on blogs etc. Of course we had no money to really promote it, and Bus Stop had slender resources but good contacts. We will be eternally grateful to Brian from Bus Stop for getting in touch for a retrospective CD. It pushed us into the internet age of music which is a better place for music than the 1990s. Without Brian the music would be basically inaccessible. You are right – it DID close a chapter – but it was a only retrospective of the vinyl – really we should release a CD of the songs up to Sarasine, then a CD of the “lost” Dishy album that never was. That lost CD should be out this year and we’re going to call it ‘Egg Banjo’ from one of Colin’s creative lyrics “Toffee torte, egg banjo, PIG!”. Colin developed into a very fine lyricist in my opinion. If we did a CD of the earlier stuff there’s some nice songs for that – “Mouth” (another in 5/4), “Albino Boy” (scorching live version), Down All The Days and some rawer recordings of the singles.

++ You are still going on, what can we expect from The Hellfire Sermons in the near future?

We have set up our label., Hidden Heartbeat and released ‘Luminous Crocodile” which is doing OK on the downloads although another effect has been to increase interest in Hymns, and in fact in Decemberists of Liverpool. Next is ‘Egg Banjo’ then maybe the early HFS stuff, or maybe Decemberists of Liverpool. We are in touch with The Jactars and DaVincis so it would be possible to release a compilation of those hidden Liverpool bands – HFS, Decemberists of Liverpool, Jenny Lind, Jactars, Peanut, DaVincis, Swim Naked, maybe even The Lids. It will never sell many, but it could be to the taste of indie fans. I would like to hope that some of those bands could become cult collectors items – a bit like the US garage babds of the 1960s – like Mouse and The Traps or the Left Banke, Beau Brummels etc. The songs are good enough to be heard for sure.

++ To finish this interview. I’ve read that Hellfire Sermons music was “oblique agit-pop”, “raw and bloody”, “chopped-up and thrown into acid bath”, “the voice of those who have no muscles”, how would you describe your music?

At certain times we could have followed a trend – but not why we were in a band – so we would make a twist We liked using discords and off-beat time signatures to make it interesting for us. Colin’s lyrics were quite personal and maybe disturbing…so I agree oblique, not overtly political, although were involved in fighting the poll tax (Gentleman Caller is about poll tax bailiffs), and supported Liverpool City Councils fight against Margaret Thatcher so maybe that came out. None of that helps you sell records! We are affable and pleasant guys, but maybe the music is fuelled by pent-up emotion. And we were all working with all those frustrations and problems so it is more of an adult music than some of the other indie bands who were in a student crowd – more gritty. I like a description someone used of urban folk music.

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Listen
Hellfire Sermons – Rachel Clean

Thanks again to Mark Mortimer for the interview. Some days ago I interviewed him about his previous band, Great Express, and now we try to remember the days of Space Seeds, another band that had a great guitar pop sound but with a broader set of influences. You can also see my previous article about Space Seeds here. Now enjoy read and discover another great band with Mark Mortimer on it!

++ Hi again Mark! Thanks for being up for another interview, this time about Space Seeds. We are going in chronological order so far, right? So tell me how did Space Seeds start after the demise of Great Express?

After the Great Express ended I was still full of songs & still as desperate as ever to make music, create & move forward so there was never any question about me stopping what I do. I carried on writing songs, making demos of them with various friends & somehow from those demos a new band was formed which was the Space Seeds. At first it wasn’t even a band, more of a solo project but my big problem is I am a crap singer & there was no way on earth it could ever be an eponymous ‘Mark Mortimer’ thing.
The mere thought of that makes me burst into fits of laughter!!

++ Who were the members and how was the recruiting process? At some point you were seven members, right?

The band’s creation coincided with that period just after I’d met my future wife Christine & she had gone to live & study in Munich, Germany & it was quite a lonely time in my life which meant I was writing tonnes of songs.

Initially, as I say, it was mostly me writing songs by myself & recording them with a nucleus of mates at the Expresso Bongo Studios in Tamworth which was run by Paul Speare. Various people from the Dream Factory & The Great Express had kindly lent a hand in the studio along with Paul (Speare), Barry Douce, who was playing keyboards on tour with the Mighty Lemon Drops & a few more.

Initially myself & Ted Wilson from the Great Express plus Gavin (Skinner) from Primal Scream recorded a piss-take of the Beastie Boys called ‘Mollusc No. 5’ & that kind of set the ball rolling. Then I wrote a tune called ‘Autumn Girl’ for Christine: I had this romantic notion of it being an audio love letter which I would post out to her in Bavaria. It had this lovely strings & flute sound which was subconsciously influenced by Love’s ‘Da Capo’ album & I asked Martin Kelly, a folky guy with a love of John Martyn & Nick Drake records, to sing lead vocals on the tune for me as I was incapable of singing in tune!

Barry & Chantal Weston (Great Express) played keyboards, Ted from the Great Express added 12-string guitars & Paul Speare played the flute parts. I played bass & acoustic guitars, added more keyboards & Julian Amos from the Great Express added some rhythm guitar & backing vocals while Tim Goode from the Dream Factory also joined in vocally. It was quite a big session & cost me a fortune but I was proud of the end result at the time & it inspired me to continue writing & recording. The next tune I wrote & recorded was called ‘Enchanted’ on which I played most of the instruments & Martin sang the vocals & this was followed by a new version of an old Dream Factory track called ‘Feel Your Touch’ which had more of a northern soul / R&B feel with big horns.

These three demos were really the start of the Space Seeds. At the time I was hanging out a lot with Gavin (Skinner) who was drumming with Primal Scream at the time & also Rob Cross who had been in a Tamworth band called the Ferocious Apaches. I’d really loved them & had even paid for them to record a demo a few months earlier at the Expresso Bongo. They were influenced by the Modern Lovers, Velvet Underground, Jesus & The Mary Chain etc & Rob was the dirtiest-sounding of their guitarists, was a fellow traveller on the psychedelic path & was one of the coolest, hippest & funniest people I’d met!

The two of us made the first official Space Seeds recording, which was a trippy instrumental of Pink Floyd’s 1967 album track ‘Chapter 24,’ before we recruited anyone else. I think we thought we could use it as a gig intro tape or something. Then I bumped into Mark Brindley – known locally as DeHavilland – outside Tamworth Arts Centre. He had left his band World Intelligence Network & we got talking & I asked him to join my new group. There were then two singers in the Space Seeds & though Mark was totally different to Martin their voices blended beautifully. At first we didn’t have a drummer & Gavin programmed some drum machine stuff to see us through until we eventually advertised & recruited Stu Pickett, who was one of Tamworth’s best known and most talented drummers. I’ve no idea why he had the stage name of ‘Stu Blain.’ Also, I had managed to come across two brilliant trumpet players, Mark Allison (from Tamowrth) & Martin Cooper (from Solihull) and they were immediately roped in. They had a more classical & big band background & I felt I learned a lot from them musically.

There was a sax player from Tamworth called Pete Clark who initially joined to help complete the horn section & it was with this line up of people that then recorded the ‘Switchblade Love’ / ‘Saturn In Her Eyes’ demo at the Expresso Bongo supplemented by Paul Speare on baritone sax & former Dream Factory players Paul Stansfield (trombone) & Andy Codling on alto sax. A few months after the demo we came across keyboard player Alan Hodgetts after another advert in the local paper.

To be honest the band’s line up was a real hotch potch of people who should never have got together!!! We all came from different backgrounds with, at times, conflicting musical tastes which meant that this band was always ever going to be a short trip but it was part of my on-going process of distillation & I’ve always thought a little conflict can be a good thing!

I don’t think I was aware of it at the time but since I deliberately destroyed the Dream Factory I was bringing together different people & seeing how varying combinations worked chemically. Often it was too ambitious, too clever for its own good & ended in tears & if I am honest this experimentation with line ups has continued all the way through until recent times with my current group DC Fontana. A bit like Pete Townshend being the Seeker, I was also continually searching though my hunt was for that elusive chemical reaction to produce great music that would last the passage of time. With the Space Seeds there was way too much diversification of backgrounds for it to ever work properly!

++ I had this theory that the name came from Star Trek, but most probably it didn’t, so care to shed some light about the origin of the name?

You were right! The name came from ‘Star Trek.’

We weren’t Trekkies at all, you understand, but Rob & I were having fairly wild psilocybin-dominated parties at the time & each week we’d want to experience watching interesting stuff on the TV to see what we could find under the surface. Usually it was ‘Barbarella’ or ‘Yellow Submarine’ but on this occasion we happened to be watching ‘Star Trek’ while tripping & decided on the band name there & then.

++ Also what would you say was the main difference, sound-wise, or maybe even the aesthetics, between this band and Great Express?

The differences were quite striking really – whereas the Great Express had a much more “rock & roll” edge & was built around powerful &, at times, heavy guitars, the Space Seeds was to be a vehicle for my lighter songs really. Obviously, having been in a soul/mod influenced band like the Dream Factory two or three years previous, working with a horn section wasn’t new to me & I re-introduced horns to my music with the Space Seeds. But whereas one or two tunes had a soul influence, by & large the music was still very psychedelic influenced with strong poppy vocal melodies & we only occasionally vamped the guitars up heavy.

++ I see there are different influences on this band as well, what were you listening at the time, maybe not that much C86 stuff?

I’ve always loved rare 60s music whether it be psychedelia, garage, soul, R&B, jazz, folk-rock, Latin soul, acid rock, exotica or whatever & that is always apparent in my songs; it’s the common thread that binds all my groups together. But my musical palette has always been very wide & incorporated a million & one different influences. In 1988 I was still very much listening to and following the whole so-called ‘indie-music’ underground & overground.

++ I read on the Tamworth bands page that you played a total of 8 gigs. Which were your favourite and why?

The Space Seeds was only a short-lived affair & really provided the bridge between the Great Express & what followed which was the unfortunately-named Bash Out The Odd. As a result there were only a few low-key local gigs & I don’t have that much of a recollection about them if honest.

++ And with Space Seeds there wasn’t also a chance to have a proper release? No label interest?

Like the Great Express I didn’t spend any time trying to court any label interest, partly as I knew full well the band was a million miles away from being ready.

++ I really enjoy the track “Switchblade Love”, it’s fantastic! Care to tell me the story behind it?

Thanks man! It’s a song that is special & personal to me and is very much a “real life” tale of fucked up love – so much so that I re-wrote it for the first DC Fontana album. It’s the tale of how love can go sour & take a violent turn. The story behind it surrounds the disintegration of my first marriage – I was married in October 1986 & yet it was over by June 1987…a real whirlwind of emotion. I guess there’s no need to get too deep into the personal reasons behind it all but it was truly off its head & ended with me hospitalized after being run over & attacked with a knife.

So the song was this fucked up cry for help & a scream of incredulity at how something so precious & pure as love could turn so dark, twisted & then end up in blood-letting. While writing the song I was examining my own role in the end of the marriage & lyrically I was trying to make sense of it all, trying to find reasons to blame myself, trying to defend the person who had phsyically injured me & a load more besides. I think great stressful moments in your life can help you produce good art & ‘Switchblade Love’ was an unusually fast song for me to write….normally it can take me weeks or even months to finish a tune but this was done & dusted in less than 10 minutes: it all came out in this huge weeping catharsis of mourning for a dead love & the deeply felt heartache & loneliness.

I never really explained the pain behind the song when I asked Mark & Martin to sing it in the studio, partly because it hurt too much to continually re-open the wounds & partly because I consciously wanted to maintain the song’s duality. And the paradox is that lyrically it’s very dark & violent while musically & melodically it’s light and poppy, almost up-lifting: this was totally deliberate. I had used all these cute major 7th chords in the track (taking inspiration from Arthur Lee’s Love group of the ’60s) & encouraged the two singers to soar and uplift. Paul Speare, who was producing the session, felt that Mark & Martin had a lovely Walker Brothers vibe to their harmonised vocals & it really worked in a poppy way so I didn’t explain too much the trauma behind the tune as I didn’t want to make the music itself dark.

++ From what I gather you only recorded 7 songs. Where did you record them? And what memories do you have from those sessions?

All songs were recorded at the Expresso Bongo recording studios in Tamworth with former Dexy’s Midnight Runners sax player Paul Speare producing the sessions. The ‘Chapter 24’ session was recorded at night & was wonderfully freaked out. I remember Paul’s wife playing keyboards with us in that session. The ‘Switchblade Love’ & ‘Saturn In Her Eyes’ session was the quintessential Space Seeds session & i fondly remember both tracks being recorded in a great spirit.

++ And which of them is your favourite one?

Defiitely ‘Switchblade Love’ & ‘Saturn In Her Eyes’ from the official Space Seeds period – both were tunes I really enjoyed recording & playing live. Otherwise ‘Autumn Girl’ was highly memorable.

++ Now looking back, how do you feel your songs have aged? You’ve recovered some for your new project, right?

Not sure if the recordings have aged very well if honest though you can, I believe, hear the vibe in ‘Switchblade’ & there is some magic in evidence there. Likewise I can still hear the original ‘Saturn In Her Eyes’ from that session – the 60s rave up outro always makes me howl with laughter with Mark doing his psychotic vocal howls.
I re-wrote both ‘Switchblade Love’ & ‘Saturn In Her Eyes’ for the debut DC Fontana album which we recorded at Parr Street Studios in Liverpool at the request of Will Sergeant, Echo & The Bunnymen’s guitarist. With ‘Switchblade Love’ we added a cute Laura Nyro type electric piano vibe to the tune and we had the honour to record with members of the Royal Philharmonic Orchestra from Liverpool (going under the pseudonym of the Liverpool Session Orchestra) who provide the lovely real strings.

On ‘Saturn In Her Eyes’ I hung out with a number of musicians from the Indian sub-continent to get a proper handle on my desire to give the track a more genuine Indian feel. This was also a true honour & it felt special breaking down the barriers of racial & geographical background. Surinder Sandhu, one of the world’s leading sarangi vurituoso players, contributed some very haunting parts to the song & Iqbal Mohammed Khan added some Urdu poetry & harmonium. Carl Peberdy played real sitar (as opposed to the cheap sampled sitar on the Space Seeds’ original version) & the circle was completed when Gavin (Skinner) played tabla & African udu drums on the track. Gav had programmed the drum machine parts for the Space Seeds’ recording of ‘Saturn In Her Eyes’ so it was a conscious circle-closing moment for me.

++ Sadly, the band lasted so little. Why and when did you split up?

The band actually metamorphosed into Bash Out The Odd when Martin Kelly quit the group around the end of 1988. We replaced him with the former Great Express singer Julian Amos& simply re-named the band there and then.

++ Then you formed Bash Out the Odd and I guess that’s another interview so we can cover that period. But going back to our previous interview you were telling me that Indian food is your favourite. Do you have a favourite indian dish?

No particular favourite dish: food is a little like music with me….I can change my top ten favourite tunes every day depending on my mood & food is the same….
Indian food can be quite an experience though I must admit & I am a committed & passionate vegetarian.

++ And what about beer? Are you into ales? I still can’t enjoy them, even if I try. I need my beer chilled!

Never been a big beer drinker I’m afraid, I don’t mind the occasional one & prefer them to be chilled too! Have always preferred the Bavarian stuff if I had to choose but I don’t drink much as I am always driving….

++ One last question, I’m curious, because of the name Space Seeds, if you are into sci-fi and stuff? Are you?

Probably no more than anyone else but when I was a kid I was crazily into the TV show “U.F.O.” – loved Nick Drake’s sister in her short shiny skirts & metallic purple bob & all those “space age” mod fashions, sci-fi grooviness.
Also, we did use on stage with DC Fontana a couple of sci-fi B movie type characters called the TV Heads at a gig in London which was a nice moment of surrealism. But I’ve never been “nerdy” about sci-fi. I do adore the freedom of some of the more out there TV shows from the late 60s like Patrick McGoohan’s “The Prisoner.”

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Listen
Space Seeds – Switchblade Love

Thanks so much to Johnny Wood for the interview! East Village were one of the finest guitar pop bands from the late 80s, early 90s. Their legacy lives on on the classic records “Drop Out” and “Hot Rod Hotel” as well as in classic songs like Vibrato, Strawberry Window or Circles. If you haven’t heard them yet, well, you better do it soon!  Johnny lives in China these days and in his spare time he paints, check out the inspiring stuff he is doing here. And now sit back, read and enjoy.

++ Hi Johnny! Thanks so much for being up for the interview. I hear nowadays you live in China? What are you doing there? Have you already learned Chinese?

I got tired of living in England, wanted something new. I always liked being on the move, so came out this way two years ago. It’s interesting. I do a spot of English teaching to keep food on the table!

++ I’ve visited your artwork site and I must say you are really good Johnny! What inspired you to paint? And who are your favourite painters ever?

Thanks .. art was my subject at school. Suddenly developed a talent for drawing at 14. Don’t know how or why. Painting was just a natural progression. And we study it at school. So it became just a thing that I do, like playing the guitar. A part of myself.
I guess Peter Blake was my first painter hero, the British POP artist. Then through him I got into Robyn Denny, a Situation artist. Edward Hopper, Van Gogh, and my all time rave Alberto Burri. There are so many … Tracey Emin I think has done some good things.

++ So I know that East Village evolved from Episode Four, who I’d love to do a feature about them in the near future, but how did this change between bands came about? Why not continue as Episode Four?

A lot of bands come to a point in their development where they feel the need to present themselves differently. We’d all moved away from our home town which E4 was synonymous with. We had gelled as a band and needed a name that represented where we were, who we were …

++ By the way, how did you knew the Kelly brothers?

I had a mate who played guitar in a band which the Kellys were in. I went along to see my mate and got to know them like that. I’d go to a lot of the gigs and started hanging out with them at other times. We liked a lot of the same music and became friends.

++ Where does the name East Village comes from?

I think Paul hit on the name. So his reason may differ but for me it comes from the place in New York where all the poets, artists, musicians etc lived and hung out. That’s what we were as a band, a ‘place’ for poets, artists and musicians. We were a very creative lot …

++ As a guitarist, who would you say were your influences? What guitar did you play during the East Village years? And what is your favourite guitar ever?

So many influences; early on the Beatles etc. then Roddy Frame from Aztec Camera. Donovan, Blind Willie McTell, Tony Joe White, Byrds – a mix really.
I played an Epiphone Casino back then, these days a cheap Chinese acoustic. I love the sound of a Gibson J200, Paul’s Rickenbacker on EV records.

++ You had already worked with Jeff Barrett with Episode Four when he was running Head, now when he was doing the Sub Aqua label you also worked with him. How important was him for your music career and what did he bring on the table?

He had so much enthusiasm and energy. He got things done. He helped us into a scene in London and through him we got our records made.

++ You gigged quite a bit, didn’t you? There were tours with House of Love and McCarthy for example. How do you remember these tours and which was your favourite gig overall that you played?

They are remembered with affection! Actually it was very exciting to go on tour and a lot of fun, despite the frustrations and long hours hanging around.
We did a lot of gigs that were memorable. Personally I have two favorites from that time; One was with the House of Love tour, where the crowd loved us more than them. Their sound man had liked us and sorted our mix out. We went down better than they did. The crowd were shouting for us and it inspired us to play our socks off and put on a bit of a show. A great time and Chadwick never spoke to us after that!
The other was in London at the Camden Falcon. It was a hot, sweaty night and the place was full. We’d started getting a good reputation and there was a bit of an expectation. London crowds could be difficult – too cool for school kind of attitude – so we decided to not fuck about. We went on, turned the amps up and blasted our way through our set which we’d decided would only be 6 songs. We played really well, no breaks, no chit chat. Knocked the crowd out and left the stage. It felt like a victory.

++ And what about anecdotes playing alongside The House of Love who at the moment were causing quite a splash in the indie music scene?

Not much to say really. we’d meet up with them en route to gigs, have a cup of tea and chat. It was pleasant. Guy Chadwick seemed a bit distant but the others were always friendly. They’d give us beer from their rider, ha ha. But the guitarist Terry became a sort of mate on that tour – he would always encourage us, and hung out with me a few times. He borrowed my guitar for one show. Wow!

++ The story says that Bob Stanley financed your album “Drop Out”. What do you remember of these recordings?

Yeah, he came to our rescue. Strange times. The music scene had changed a lot very quickly. We were kind of out on a limb. But we had some good songs that we had to get on tape. We scraped some money together somehow and booked a studio with some empty promises … thats when Bob stepped in. He’d heard some of the results.
Overall the sessions were good. We wrote Silver Train in the studio and had fun with that. My best memory of that was going back to Martin’s place in west London after a late session and listening to what we’d just recorded as the sun rose. We’d smoked somthing to help us relax and suddenly there appeared hundreds of hot air balloons in the dawn sky, hanging there over the skyline. It was very beautiful actually.

++ I would assume because of this, that Bob Stanley was an important figure for East Village. I’m wondering how did you all knew him? He was a big fan of your music obviously 🙂

I think we met him through his fanzine … he asked to interview us. Then we went to the pub with him or something and realized he was a good guy and he liked us.

++ You made many great songs, indiepop classics, but I want to pick one so you tell me the story behind it. Care to tell me what is “Circles” about?

I’d love to but I don’t know, ha ha! Martin wrote that one … but I connected with it because I could sense the feeling of wanting to hold onto someone when you can feel them slipping away. Its always in the morning? ha ha, I have no idea, maybe a case of too much information!!

++ And what about your favourite East Village song, which one would it be?

Actually I like a lot of them. What Kind of Friend Is This? has a good feel, I like Vibrato for personal reasons, Strawberry Window is a nice pop song, Kathleen …

++ So you split up on stage at the New Cross venue. Was this planned? Why did you split? And what did you all do after?

Well, I went to the pub for 5 years, ha ha … Martin became more involved with Heavenly, so did Spence. Paul formed Birdie and is now a film maker. I did a degree in Fine Art after I sobered up …
It wasn’t planned … times had been difficult. You know we were getting older, had relationships, no money etc. Where was the band going? We had this sell out gig, went on stage and someone’s guitars had gone out of tune. Just one of those things but it was a breaking point – literally. It just seemed to sum up our luck at that time. We all realised it in front of all those people … so we looked at each other and knew. Ok fuck it, here’s a good a place as any to split, ha ha.

++ Talking about venues, which were your favourite venues in London back then? And was there any sort of scene/community then between the guitar pop bands? Which bands from the time did you enjoy going to their gigs?

Camden Falcon was always good to us .. the Phil Kaufman Club. Yeah we got friends with some of the bands. Wishing Stones were mates. Later the Rockingbirds.

++ Some years later Summershine Records put together the “Hot Rod Hotel” compilation. How did this came about? How did you have a connection with the Australian label?

That was through Martin and Heavenly. I didn’t have anything to do with it other than say ok.

++ And then in the past decade both the album and this compilation were released again, in deluxe editions, in Japan thanks to Excellent Records. Also they released a 7″ with unreleased tracks. All of these, are already sold out of course. How do you feel about your music being sought after by collectors up to this day? And if there’s any more plans to release your songs again?

Well it feels great. We were a good band, very creative and had a truth about us. People that like us really like us. And that’s a hell of a lot better than looking back with embarrassment.
I don’t think there’s any plans to release any EV. Maybe do something of my own …

++ Because of this ongoing interest in East Village, I wonder how do you think your songs have aged?

Pretty well I think, especially the Drop Out ones. And that’s because we helped, or were a link in the chain that inspires the guitar bands today.

++ Looking back in time, what were your highlights of being in East Village? Any regrets at all?

Yeah some regrets for sure. But mostly glad I was in it. The highlights; recording sessions, the tours, just the fact we got it together.

++ A couple of more questions. Is there any interesting guitar pop in China?

Difficult one that … you hear some nice guitar on some tracks. I haven’t heard anything that really grabs me but you have to realise the culture here.
Sometimes bands play out on the street and they can have something about them but the equipment is crap. Maybe in the future something will happen, when the country opens a bit more.

++ And what is your favourite Chinese food? Is it much different to the one you find in every corner of every major city of the world?

Yes a lot different apart from fried rice. It’s very spicy … Hunan food. Beijing Duck is always a good option.

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Listen
East Village – Circles

Thanks so much to Jason Brown for the fantastic interview! Back in April 2010 I wrote about this fantastic band from Manchester and happily some days ago Jason got in touch with me to clarify and answer any questions I may had! Great to learn that there are many unreleased songs by this band, and a 12″ that I don’t have! Enjoy!

++ Hi Jason! How are you doing? Whereabouts in the world are you? Are you still making music?

HI there. I’m doing well thanks. I’m still living in Manchester keeping abreast of the latest on the recent surge of civil disturbance! I haven’t made any music in the past few years since the birth of my first child in 2007 – been busy doing lots of dad stuff. Up till then I played and co-wrote a couple of albums with Tom Hingley (ex Inspiral Carpets) and Steve and Paul Hanley (The Fall).

++ How was the recruiting process for This Gigantic World? Were you all from the same town? How did you know each other?

I moved to Manchester from Derry (Ireland) in September 1988 to study for a degree but really using the opportunity to get to England and get a band together. In the decades before the internet the recruitment process was old school. I trawled around music shops and alternative hangouts answering adverts for guitarists. Simon had an ad up looking for a band – I remember it well, it sounded promising so I rang him and we met up. We got on well and decided to go for it. From what I remember we put ads out for a rhythm section and Matt (bass) tuned up fairly soon – he slotted in immediately so the three of us started writing while looking for a drummer. We went through a few flakey drummers before we got Trev who had been in a band with Matt in their home town of Grimsby. Then TGW was born and we spent 9 months locked in a cellar wiring a set.

++ So where does the name of the band come from?

I seem to remember Simon came up with it. Something to do with having different perspectives. A bit like Gulliver’s travels I suppose where the little people live in this gigantic world – something like that… I think we were under the impression it sounded good so we went along with it. I was also a big fan of That
Petrol Emotion so I guess unconsciously a triple barrel name felt good.

++ “Raft” is such a fantastic song, care to tell me the story behind it?

Yeah it is a great pop tune – I was quite pleased when I heard it recently for the first time again in years! The guitar riff came from a sound check and we carved it out in the rehearsal room. We spent a lot of time carving arrangements as a band. Simon wrote the lyrics which I think speak for themselves.

++ And what about “Hoover Bag”?

A bit of a funky groove really with a classic Madchester wah wah. It was a Matt riff I seem to remember – he was the master of melodic bass playing. (The lyrics were written on the back of a hoover bag, hence the name…)

++ I was wondering, why the release came out in a 12″ if it was only 2 songs? You could have added more! Or maybe made it a 7″?

I can’t for the life of me remember why that was decided. I guess money was a factor.

++ How was it working with Cieran from That Petrol Emotion? Any anecdotes you could share?

Well I enjoyed it as I was a big fan of the Petrols. I knew Ciaran from my Derry days so we had a bit of history before that. He tweaked the song a bit and brought an engneer with him to get the best result we could. I’m sworn to secrecy with the anecdotes…

++ Is the 12″ your only release? Were there maybe some compilation appearances?

TGW released two 12”s – Raft furrowed by Swagger (1992 I think). There was a third (everyday Living) but that never made it to vinyl after the recording.

++ Why didn’t you get to do more releases?

Good question! We put a lot of energy trying to get a deal with a major. We were close to success with Slash records initially and when this fell through we spent quite a while thrashing out a deal with Radioactive Records (a subsidiary of MCA) until the A & R woman left the label to write a biography on the recently demised Kurt Cobain. Of course when you’re A&R contact leaves you’re kind of screwed. Her replacement swiftly moved on and signed Black Grape instead (doh!). In hindsight really it would have been sensible to keep banging out indie 12”s but again getting finance or small labels to support the release was always a challenge.

++ Do you have lots of unreleased stuff lying around maybe?

Yeah-heaps. We spent a lot of time writing and recording. Simon got in touch a couple of years ago to get some online presence and collate our demoes before they rot in the loft! There’s probably a couple of albums worth of stuff of varying quality. There’s a couple of videos on YouTube (Peach and Jah Candy) – a guy in Japan saw the vids recently which rompted him to buy the two
12’s – he got in touch saying how much he likes
them (which is nice…)

++ Who were the “World In Action” label?

I think that was just an indie that we set up but we got distribution through Action records.

++ What about gigs? Did you gig a lot as This Gigantic World? Any particular gigs you remember?

Yeah we did loads of gigs around Britain and Ireland. We had a surge of interest in Sheffield due to playing a couple of university gigs and having our first demo bootlegged – they were good times.
I remember supporting the Divine Comedy in Belfast when they were three young blokes with some good songs and were in their infancy. I remember Trevor spotted Neil Hannon’s lyrics even then…he always had an ear for these things (not bad for a drummer 🙂

++ What other bands from that period would you recommend?

The Sandmen were fantastic. Check out the Home/ Dustdevil and Tighten Up. A real mix of dub and indie – way ahead of it’s time – great rhythm
section. Of course all the Manchester favourites – Stone Roses, Mondays, Inspirals, The Fall, The Smiths, James et al

++ When and why did you call it a day? Are you all still in touch?

I suppose we just got tired. We gave it 100% for 6 years and packed it in some time in 1994/95 I think. Trevor had already jumped ship a year earlier and we were playing with another drummer. By that stage Oasis and Britpop were taking off and I think we felt we’d missed the boat (or the Raft for that matter).
I still see Trev quite a bit and Matt when he’s in Manchester. Simon we see occasionally.

++ Looking back in time, what would you say were the highlights of This Gigantic World?

The whole experience really. I’ve released and recorded a range of records since but it was TGW that was the youthful “us against the world” band. It was great to spend so much time writing, recording and playing music with no boundaries and highly charged ambition. We did some great gigs and drank copious amount of free beer…

++ Now the most important questions. Favourite beer? Favourite English food?

My recent favourite is Cumbrian Ale. And curry of course 🙂

++ Thanks again, anything else you’d like to add?

Here are some other bits I’ve dug out which may be of use. (Landscape.doc) (Portrait.doc) [both of these are Word files and includes photos and magazine/newspaper cut-outs of the band)

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Listen
This Gigantic World – Raft

Thanks so much to Mark Mortimer for the great and lengthy interview. On November 2010 I wrote about this great Tamworth band on the blog and recently got in touch with the man behind it. The songs by Great Express are lost gems that deserve to be listened now. Great guitar pop from the golden years of indiepop. Sadly they were never properly released. For sure they should be showcased in a future volume of The Sound of Leamington Spa! Enjoy!

++ Hi Mark! Thanks so much! I know you’ve been in many great guitar pop bands, but I’d like to start our interviews with Great Express! My first question is, how was Tamworth back then in 1986? Has it changed a lot? Was it a good place to play music?

I got to hand out a mini history lesson for any of this to make sense so bear with me!

Tamworth is middle England’s freak-out zone or at least it was back in the early and mid 80s…. For those who have never heard of the place it’s a fairly small & inconsequential town just 14 miles north of the country’s second city, Birmingham and though in mediaeval times it was the capital of the old Kingdom of Mercia, little has ever happened of consequence for many centuries.

It was the town that manufactured cheap plastic three-wheeled cars called Reliant which were made famous by the 80s TV comedy ‘Only Fools & Horses’ (my dad spray-painted them for a living) and the only musical person to come from the town of any note was Julian Cope of the Teardrop Explodes.

Tamworth was bitten hard in the ass by punk in the late mid and late 70s and the venom went deep I am delighted to say which really did kick start a tiny “garage band” scene in the town….

I was very very fortunate to be part of a great scene at my school where I was surrounded by cool, creative people all desperate to be in a band and make a statement. We had a communual diary we secretly wrote in during lessons at school without the teachers knowing and called it the ‘Memorable Book.’

There was Donald (Skinner), Mas (Matthew Lees), Bam (Andrew Baines), Clem (Paul Clements), Sedge (Stephen Edge), Poge (Ian Harding), Nana (Chris Underwood), Derek (Goodwin), Sam (Holiday) & myself and it was a VERY cool scene.

Whereas punk & new wave sounds turned us on, we were also into some 60s stuff like the Who and Syd Barrett plus we liked the burgeoning mod revival scene & Two Tone but it was bands like Echo & The Bunnymen, the Teardrop Explodes & Joy Division who fuelled our dreams.

There seemed to be a new band formed every lunch hour at school and they had names like (Fetch The) Comfy Jigsaw, Slightly Green, The Travelling Dog, Thirty Frames A Second, the Classified Ads etc….none of us could really play & we were more into the idea of being in a band than actually having any musical ability that warrnted it!

There was intense rivalry between the bands and you counted your closest mates as being the ones you were allied to in your own particular group at any particular time – it was quite brilliant.

There was one exception to the “we can’t play very well” rule: Donald Ross Skinner who we called simply Donny in those days. He could not only play guitar properly but he could tune the strings, knew chords and his dad, having been a jazz musician of note, had obviously handed down some great musical DNA to him.

Ironically, Donald used to play drums mostly at school even though he was already the best guitarist in the town aged 15…

Donald did briefly play guitar with my first proper band The Dream Factory who were a sort of psychedelic soul group and during the summer of 1982 I first became friendly with Julian Cope who had just moved back to Tamworth to escape the implosion of the Teardrop Explodes.

I was a teenage trainee journalist just out of school but being a huge fan of the Teardrops, I promised myself I’d blag my way into meeting him by asking for an interview.

I didn’t realise that Julian was in a very emotionally weird place at that time and was not far away from a nervous breakdown because his first marriage had also gone kaput and he was seeking solace in Tamworth not the attentions of hite teenage admirers.

Through sheer persistence and illegal trespass in his garden, I eventually got Julian to answer the door.

He was initially freaked out and refused an interview but offered me a cup of tea and a chat which I readily accepted.

We sat there listening to lots of rare 60s psychedelia and garage stuff and everything seemed to click between us….within a few weeks I had played him my first Dream Factory recording. COincidentally we had recorded at Steve Adams’ home studio on the outskirts of Tamworth Julian had just made some far out recordings including “Hey High Class Butcher” & “Wreck My Car” which wound up on the B side of his first solo single, “Sunshine Playroom” a little later.

Anyway, it seemed we had lots in common; Julian was attracted to my enormous appetite to hear new music and to expand my view on 60s music and he was also totally into Donald’s guitar playing with the Dream Factory.

That eventually led to Donald being drafted into Julian’s self-styled “two car garage band” and I carried on with Dream Factory without him.

We built up an enormous following across the UK and had a few singles, one of which dented the charts, but then dissolved in 1986 as I was determined to make the band more lysergic whereas our singer wanted the group to softer and jazzier.

In the final six months of the Dream Factory I had already formed The Great Express as an outlet for my new direction and I guess it was influenced a lot by the C86 generation of bands and also I was really getting into the Stooges, MC5, Blue Cheer etc.

At this time in Tamworth most people were in a band and most of them were shocking but there were some very talented people about and the town did manage to earn itself a reputation which spread far and wide for being a happening place.

Musically, it was very diverse from heavy rock bands including Wolfsbane who were about to become quite big, through to quite twee pop groups, punk bands, synth pop stuff and so on. There was a developing “indie” scene and I was very active on it really.

In those days there were a clutch of small venues and most gigs in the town were well supported although most of the audience were quite snobbish as most people were in bands and everyone was judging what they saw against their own groups which I always found amusing!

But there was a certain charm to it, there was great energy and a real buzz even if most of the bands were rubbish.

Has Tamworth changed a lot since those halcyon days? Most definitely!

There are no venues, very few bands and the whole strident band culture has dissolved, a lof of the town’s youth have suffered X Box apathy or dance club-itis these days, and it’s very sad…

++ Tell me about Great Express. How did you all know each other? And what sparked you all to start this band? I heard it was a vision of yours?

The Great Express was a personal vision, a reaction against the Dream Factory falling at the final hurdle.

The Factory had been on the cusp of “making it” & we had a national fan base, mostly of mods and scooterists but I had become disillusioned with the violence that had tainted that scene; having watched some skinheads attack reggae star Desmond Dekker on stage at a scooter rally I was sick of it all and musically I was really aching to branch away from the sound of the DF.

We had been given a tag of being a new generation mod revival band which wasn’t my initial blueprint at all and I was both depressed that we had got so close to success and also that musically I had much wider horizons than that “mod” tag was allowing me to get away with.

We had just been beaten to a major record deal by the then unknown Stone Roses and I really wanted to toughen the band’s sound up & was already writing songs with a spikier feel which really pissed off the Factory singer, Tim Goode who I had been best friends with since the age of 5.

I was listening a lot to Pere Ubu, the Modern Lovers and Television and going to see the Mighty Lemon Drops play whereas Tim was listening to Sade and the Style Council!!

I knew it was going to end in tears but I hadn’t quite got the courage to fully quit so I decided to start the Great Express as a side project.

Also, Donald’s younger brother Gavin had filled a “friends’ vacancy” for me since Donald had gone off globe-trotting with Julian on tour and Gav was this brilliant, off-his-head guy who was SO funny! Just great!

I hung out a lot with Gavin, Barry Douce (who was playing keyboards with the Mighty Lemon Drops) and Rob Cross who later played guitar with Mr. Ray’s Wig World and it was fairly wild, trippy and rock & roll!

Anyway, Gav followed in the Skinner family tradition and was already a drummer of real distinction. He was soon playing with Primal Scream & so my personal circle was moving far away from that of the Dream Factory & I was happy to be saying adios to their soul & mod vibe while still retaining a huge love of rare 60s music.

The first incarnation of Great Express was myself and school friend Brian Lacey and we came across a girl keyboard player called Chantal Weston, one of those hanging out at gigs on the Tamworth scene and she was cool. It didn’t work out with Brian and so I advertised in the local newspaper for a new guitar-playing lead singer.

Then I decided I had to climb on the Express full time so I closed the Factory and at our last gig Tim punched me in the face and made my nose bleed while were on stage but I just hugged and kissed him as I felt his frustration and I knew I had ruined his dreams.

So having freed myself of the Dream Factory yoke I wanted to make the Great Express an out of control train that could speed along mytholgical tracks to indie-pop notoriety and it was this appropriate imagery of speed and excess that drove me on.

The first track I wrote for the band was called “Total Excess At 200 Yards” which was a screaming mixture of dirty overdriven guitars, pounding tribal drums, cranked-up reverse sitars and ghost-like screams by yours truly, recorded while I was totally off my face. The second track was called “Graveyard Faces” and the third was “Wankerside”, a sneering reference to the Tamworth shopping centre Ankerside.

It’s fair to say that soul and mod music was a million miles away now! But I still needed new cohorts and fast so I was delighted to audition several people at my house early in 1986.

Two well known personalities from the Tamworth scene showed up among those interested: Julian Amos was someone I knew from a band called Orange Blossom Special and he was a good rhythm guitarist with a love of Postcard type pop which was great in my book.

I auditioned him first and told him he was in without even seeing the rest of them.

Half an hour later I auditioned Ted Wilson, a long-haired guitarist whose background was from the town’s heavy rock scene and yet it turned out he was a huge Julian Cope fan and was big time into the Mighty Lemon Drops, Crazyhead, Pop Will Eat Itself and other new bands I was into.

I was really impressed by the fact he loved the MC5 and the Velvet Underground and that had swayed me to have him in the band even before he played a note at the audition.

As it was, he was a much more gifted player than Julian Amos but not as strong vocally. Even though I had my heart set on one singer-guitarist I also told Ted he was in!

I didn’t sleep afterwards trying to figure out which of the two I was going to have to disappoint and then realised how stupid I’d been and that great bands often have two guitarists!

As for the drummer, Dave Burgess was a 17 year old from a nearby wealthy village but he’d been a fan of the Dream Factory and although I had no idea if he could play drums I liked him a lot and so he was in too without an audition.

++ What about the name Great Express?

I honestly felt my musical journey was a trip and I guess it still is so it seemd wholly appropriate!

The fact that Donald had also been in a brilliant band (with a brilliant name) called Freight Train in 1985 during his downtime with Copey (check out ‘Man’s Laughter’ on Bam Caruso Records, it’s GREAT) genuinely had nothing to do with it!

I also liked words with energy: the word ‘Great’ came actually from the World War 2 film “The Great Escape” but I dug it because the word drips with positive energy while “Express” came from speed.

When this band came together it coincided with enormous upheaval in my personal life.

My marriage collapsed, I was attacked by someone with a knife, run over by the same person in their car & deserted by my family so it was a crazed period & felt like my heart had been torn from my body, impaled on a fork and roasted over a blazing fire for most of the time the Great Express was in existence.

Therefore, it was quite suitable that the group should boast a monicker that summed up the aggression and speed of those psychotic times.

++ I’ve listened to many of your bands, and I can say Great Express is maybe the one closest to the indiepop/C86 sound. Also with this band you played gigs along C86 bands. Who were the influences you had at that time? Which other bands of the period did you like?

This is probably because the Great Express were born in the spring of 1986!

I loved many bands from that period if honest; it was a thrilling time for music and was a lot like the punk explosion all over again….I was into loads of people from the Mighty Lemon Drops, the Smiths, Woodentops, Lloyd Cole and many more.

I was already aware of Primal Scream through Gavin and adored their stuff and loved the Pastels too and the Loft.

There was so much great stuff I loved at the time and other names I’d throw into this would include the Jesus & Mary Chain, Laugh, Jasmine Minks, June Brides, Shop Assistants, Talulah Gosh, Brilliant Corners etc….

++ And talking about gigs, you played many! Which ones were the ones you remember with nostalgia, and why?

Actually, I played far fewer gigs in those days with the Great Express than I do now!! The Great Express wasn’t in existence for that long actually but we played a number of mostly small and low key gigs.

There were a few that I remember with nostalgia, mostly because I had met Christine, my current wife, around this time and 1987, in particular, was an emotional bulldozer of a year as I split with my first wife in the summer, met Christine and fell in love with her and a lot of the tunes I was writing around that time dealt with pain and joy in equal amounts.

I particularly enjoyed a Great Express gig we played at Leicester University and I can remember that Ted had bought a lovely 12-string guitar and, like Jim Beattie was using it through a distortion pedal to get this beautiful high-octane sound.

We also travelled south to play a gig on the Isle of Wight off the south coast of England and that was great – I remember us messing about in the outdoors swimming pool before and after the gig and drowning our sorrows because Thatcher had just been bizarrely re-elected as Prime Minister and I was horrified!

++ You recorded around 10 songs. How come none of them was properly released? Was there any label interest?

You have to remember we had no management, no financial backing and were all young people just out of school with rubbish paying jobs and no money.

So basically we couldn’t afford to self fund a music career like I am doing these days with DC Fontana & we recorded cheaply and incredibly quickly whenever we had a spare £400 and never thought too far ahead.

The songs were recorded to demo standard only; there was no producer really, just me.

And we didn’t go out our way to seek a record label either…I had just come out of the Dream Factory and I had initially hoped the group’s manager Neil Rushton was going to stick with me and the Express. Indeed, Neil had indicated he would and were close but then Neil to flew to Chicago (& then on to Detroit) as part of his northern soul record-hunting activities and he stumbled across the new underground house and techno scenes in Michigan and fell in love with electronic music.

Though Neil and I stayed very close friends, he went on to be largely responsible for house & techno sounds getting a foothold in the UK and ended up forming his own record label but though he wished the Great Express well he no longer had the time or energy to help us out.

He was ploughing all his energies into this new form of dance music which he identified as a sort of nouveau northern soul, very underground, very much fuelled by drugs; it had its own esoteric Rites of Passages and codes and Neil was intensely charmed by the experiemental electronic musicians he met like Kevin Saunderson (later of Inner City), Derrick May, Juan Atkins etc.

Just to complete this part of the story, a few years later I later went to work for Neil’s record label Network during the 1990s as his Head of Publicity and although techno & house music was never my bag I adored the anarchic punky attitude of the label and we were very much like the dance music brothers of Creation and, indeed, McGee was great friends of ours.

Working at Network was wonderful and Neil Rushton was a wonderful maverick man to have as your boss during that time.

++ All of your songs were recorded at the Expresso Bongo Studios. How was that experience?

Wonderful, I hold those sessions with deep affection.

The studio was run by Paul “Snaker” Speare who was a top session sax player and had been a member of Dexy’s Midnight Runners around the time of their monster global hit “Come On Eileen” from their “Too Rye Ay” album in ’82 and he then played with Elvis Costello & The Attractions as the TKO Horns and also the Specials so he was someone I admired musically.

He was (and remains) a great friend and was very encouraging; I learned a lot of musicality from him and he broadened my musical and studio knowledge enormously.

Even though the Expresso Bongoo was a basic demo studio I always felt we produced good results considering the relatively small sums of money spent and I spent may long days and nights cocooned in there drinking tea, laughing until I wept with Paul – he has occasionally played sax with DC Fontana in recent times.

++ And what about working with Donald Ross Skinner (Julian Cope’s guitarist)? What did he bring on the table?

Despite Donald going on tour all over the world with Julian and them enjoying hit records and moving in different circles we stayed in regular contact and of course so it should be because he was one of my closest & true best friends.

We are very close like brothers.

I have always admired and marvelled at his brilliant musicianship. I was never jealous as such and got a great kick of sitting in front of the TV set seeing him doing great things because at one point it looked like Julian was going to be a huge mainstream star around the hit “World Shut Your Mouth.”

It was great when he agreed to come over to the Expresso Bongo and help oversee the recording of “(You Could) Change My World” – I was beaming from ear to ear and he added some great techniques like playing the organ through a fuzzbox which is something Julian Cope would do a lot.

That was another growing experience and though that session was short I loved it and I knew that at some stage we would do it again only properly, which is what turned out to be when Donald became my producer with DC Fontana recently.

++ Among the songs I’ve been able to listen from Great Express I really love “Silent Head”. What’s the story behind this song?

Thanks, very good of you man.

Lyrically it was about my then girlfriend Christine who I fell head over heels in love with during a very traumatic period of my life. She had been granted a place in college in Munich, Germany so our time together was very short and we spent it under the stars with her head resting on my shoulder, as the words of the song went!

We were married in 1993 and are still together today.

Musically, the song was built around a tom-tom heavy drum pattern heavily influenced by Joy Division and the tune had just two chords with Ted playing a chiming 12-string guitar riff I’d come up with and Chantal contributing a cute keyboard line using a very primitive keyboard sound that was supposed to sound like a sitar but it was nothing like one!

Coincidentally I have very recently re-written this tune as “DevilAngel” for DC Fontana using a cimbalom instead of cheap keyboard so watch out for that in the future!

++ Have you ever thought of putting together as a proper release your songs?

I am not sure that many people would be really interested if I am honest!

Also the original tapes from the demo we made (Witch-Well, Pieces, Heavenly Heavenly etc) have gone missing so I only have an inferior cassette to master from.

++ So when and why did you split? What happened after?

The band kind of ran its course – it was all over within 18 months really. There were no punches at the end, no arguments, nothing extreme.

If honest I can’t quite remember the reason it all ended but I think it was more of a case that the band evovled into another one. I know Ted left because his work committments as a telephone engineer became too difficult and the drummer quit the area.

I kept writing songs and demoing them with friends from the Great Express and Dream Factory and this eventually turned into a band I called the Space Seeds which was succeeded by the appallingly-named Bash Out The Odd and Julian (Amos) re-appeared in this band.

++ Are you still in touch with the rest of your bandmates? If so, what are all of you doing these days?

Sadly no.

Last time I spoke to Ted was ten years ago but I believe he is still living locally but not musically active.

Julian simply vanished one day….I drove to his house to take him to a rehearsal for Bash Out The Odd and his dad said he had left the house to move to another part of the country to become a private detective which was really bizarre as he hadn’t told us!

That was the last time I spoke to him, really sad.

I shared a bedsit with Chantal briefly for six months in 1988 but haven’t seen her since. Drummer Dave is now living in Australia it would seem.

++ Looking back in time, those years seemed to have been they heyday of guitar pop. Did you feel any sense of a community or scene back then? And what was the best thing, your highlights, of being on Great Express?

You are quite right – there was a communal spirit of sorts and deffo there was a scene, at least in Tamworth. I think there was a feeling the town was kind of “losersville,” a kind of hangover fromt he punk days.

And there was this vibe that we were all struggling to break out of the place and gain some recognition.

The truth is that the majority of Tamworth’s bands from that time weren’t up to much though there were several interesting and really talented personalities from that time.

++ And talking about Great Expresses and trains. What has been your favourite train journey in your life?

The continuous train set journey I had in 1974 as a young kid….I spent hours watching my train set imagining I was in charge of the trip……

++ One last question, the culinary one. What’s your favourite British dish?

I became a vegetarian in 1987 and I tend to like Mediterranean & Indian food more than the British stuff if honest

++ Thanks again Mark! Anything else you’d like to add?

The interest in the Great Express is enormously surprising and pleasing for me and I want to thank you for taking the time to contact me about such a turbulent and exciting period in my life.

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Listen
Great Express – Silent Head

Thanks so much to Péter Palátsik for the interview! The Legendary Bang, well, they are legendary in my book! They were a fantastic band from Itzehoe/Hamburg in the late 80s, early 90s, that released a couple of singles on Marsh-Marigold, both of them truly fantastic. Fast guitars, frantic guitars, great energy, and catchy lyrics mixed with boy and girl vocals, were their trademark. They should have been big! Enjoy the interview!

++ Hello Péter! How are you doing? Whereabouts in Germany are you these days?

I live in Berlin, which supposedly is the coolest city in the world, but honestly since I stopped going out much, I can’t really tell anymore. I see many tourists who seem to enjoy themselves very much. No, honestly, if you think about music, Berlin is maybe not the most vibrant place to be. Berlin is all about fashion, art and maybe clubbing.

++ How did The Legendary Bang start? Was it your first band?

Phew, let my try to remember. It’s such a long time ago. I guess it all started with the C86 sampler and the Smiths breaking up in 87, or so. Jens, Martin and me, we were schoolmates and I guess, Jens maybe had the idea to form a band.
Maybe you also need to ask him these questions. Jens was always the one documenting everything we did with the band, also having the idea and the urge to record the first sessions on tape and trying to sell them on the school yard. He always had a very good sense of marketing.

++ Who were the members? How did the recruiting process work out?

First it was Jens, Martin and me and two other friends. They left the band soon, though, as soon as we started to actually play instruments, play more gigs. It took several tapes with weird noisy songs that sounded more like BIG FLAME on drugs than real music.
When I moved to Hamburg and met Oliver from Marsh Marigold, the whole thing became much more serious and when Britta and Sandra joined the band, we actually only then really became a band.

++ Where does the name The Legendary Bang comes from?

You should ask Jens, he knows the answer, I don’t really remember, haha!

++ How did you find out about indiepop? Who would you say were the main influences of the band? Just out of curiosity, were you big fans of The Wedding Present?

I started listening to THE SMITHS, when I went on a school trip to England in 84, or 85. They were a revelation to me as much as bands like ORANGE JUICE, THE GO-BETWEENS or THE PALE FOUNTAINS, AZTEC CAMERA, THE STYLE COUNCIL, etc. But the C86 sampler was like a bible to me. The last song on the record was My favourite dress by THE WEDDING PRESENT and that was the moment I thought: “I want to play music!” I started to learn how to play guitar and because it was so difficult, I was actually mostly interested in playing very, very fast!
So, yes, the WEDDING PRESENT were a major influence. Still, when I listen to early Weddoes, it gives my the chills of pure excitement.

++ Those late 80s, early 90s, in Germany seem to have had lots of noteworthy guitar pop bands. Why did you think that happened? What do you think triggered that?

Good question. Maybe it started with BERND BEGEMANN and his band DIE ANTWORT or with the FAST WELTWEIT cassette sampler. Suddenly from everywhere bands popped up and played wonderful music. At those times everyone wanted to be in a band. Strangely enough not much of it is still left. Most bands are forgotten. Who still knows DIE FÜNF FREUNDE, although I still believe, they are until today the best German pop band, ever!

++ How was it like in Itzehoe? Were there any other bands there? Did you ever move to Hamburg?

Itzehoe was hell and I always wanted to leave as soon as possible. In retrospect we had a pretty fun time, though. I guess, especially Jens, Martin and me, we made the best of it. And having a band was like being in a gang, or so. Than, after high school, I was the first one who moved to Hamburg, because I started studying. There I met Oliver Goetzl at a GO-BETWEENS concert and we immediately connected. He was very upbeat and talking about his label, selling records from a plastic bag. He then listened to one of our obscure tapes and wanted us to record a 7″. Oliver actually was the very first person who said that we were good, haha! Until then we were just hanging out in Jens’ bedroom, torturing our instruments and screaming nonsense over pure noise and silly beats from a Roland TR-303.

++ As follows from the fact that Germany is not known as a bastion for indiepop or the kind of music that Marsh-Marigold would release, how did it feel coming from a town like Itzehoe, and then being known the world over, at least in the indiepop scene?

We didn’t feel special or anything, at least not for me. I just wanted to get out and I also didn’t take the whole band thing too serious. Like I never wanted to be a musician, I always wanted to make movies. Actually the first time I met some very nice Japanese guys at the last Sarah-Records event who not only knew our band but also where totally excited to meet me, while HEAVENLY were playing on stage, I realized for the first time that maybe some people out there actually may have liked what we did.

++ I read that even before signing to Marsh-Marigold, you were already friends with Oliver. How come? Did you go to Hamburg often?

As I said, I met Oliver at a GO-BETWEENS concert. SO, please see above.
Meeting Oliver with his spiky earring and his energy and love for music, or Sonja Commentz or Henning Fristzenwalder from DIE FÜNF FREUNDE, who both still are very close friends of my who I love dearly, was like meeting the coolest people on earth.

++ How did you get a deal with Marsh-Marigold? Was it with contracts and all, or just a handshake and some good German beer?

We never signed anything. Mainly because Oliver was afraid that as soon as Marsh-Marigold would become too big he would have to pay taxes. We also paid for the studio and the producer, who was Carol von Rautenkranz, the guy who discovered TOCOTRONIC.

++ Speaking of which, which is your favourite beer?

Haha, I don’t drink much. Since I live in Berlin, I sometimes like to drink Astra, because it’s this shabby beer from Hamburg. But I like it.

++ You started quite noisy but during time you became more and more mellow. Was there any reason behind that?

Very simple: We actually learned to play our instruments. Still Jens for example refused to play anything else than C, G or D minor because everything else was rock music in his opinion.

++ How do you remember your gigs? Were there always a big crowd? What are the ones you remember the most?

I remember we once had a smoke machine. Where was that, again? Anyway. We played in front of 10 people and sometimes more. Once we played a festival in Leipzig and the place was packed! I remember we rocked that place.

++ First 7″ was “Big Bluff”, and it’s great! Was it the first time you went into a recording studio? How was that experience?

Thanks you for the compliment. That is very kind of you. That was actually really the first time we went to a studio and the recording took ages. We also paid for the whole thing ourselves, because Oliver never had any money to pay for the studio.
Recording was difficult for us, because suddenly we had to play very exact and precise. Two things that didn’t really fit to us. I remember we had a few fights and I also remember sitting in the mixing and didn’t hear any differences. We recorded the record in one day and had, I guess two days of mixing, which didn’t interest me at all, because I could never hear any difference.

++ Your second 7″ was dedicated to “Louise Brooks”. Why? Were you a big fan of hers?

Henning from DIE FÜNF FREUNDE was always in love with Audrey Hepburn and me, I was obsessed with Louise Brooks. She had the most astonishing career, being one of the most beautiful women of her time and when she had enough of acting she worked as a salesgirl in New York. She also was a heavy drinker and married a millionaire, just to divorce him only a few months later. She just didn’t care what others were thinking of her. She even had a one-night affair with Greta Garbo and she at that time we recorded the record was my ideal of the woman I wanted to be in love with and because I had just read her biography LULU IN HOLLYWOOD, I convinced the others to pay tribute to her by naming the record after her.

++ On this record you released maybe my favourite songs of yours: “The Sound of Love”. Care to tell me the story behind this song? It’s so good!

I wrote that song because I loved TALULAH GOSH so much at that time and wanted to do something with a similar energy. Also Jens and me always talked about the perfect pop song which in our opinion had to be under 2 minutes. That’s actually why it’s so fast and has no C-part. Sandra was suffering so much playing the drum part that fast to keep the song short and if you listen carefully, you hear how much she is struggling to keep the tempo straight. I still love the song and I think it’s maybe one of the best songs, we ever recorded. It’s a sweet and simple pop song. Carol von Rautenkranz maybe had the biggest influence on the song. He totally understood what the songs needed and kept it very pure and simple. He also had the idea to tweak Britta’s voice for the background singing of the song.

++ Have you seen the “Happy” video made by a Japanese fan on Youtube? It’s really fun!! Why didn’t you make a video back in the day?

I like it a lot and am still proud of that video. I don’t know the story behind it, though. Btw. I just watched the women’s football finale and the Japanese women played brilliantly against the USA.

++ What about the artwork of both 7″s, where did you get those photos?

Jens is the master mind behind the art work. He can definitely tell you more, if you ask him.

++ Oh! and what about this… is there any secret formula to make short songs? Seems nobody can do so these days!

I don’t know, we had so many ideas and songs we wanted to play, but for example at a concert we always played with one or two more bands which left us with maybe half an hour of stage time. We actually only tried to play as much songs as possible. Also we were still influenced by Punk, where the songs can be very short as well. Especially Jens listened to a lot of Punk music. And any song longer than 3 minutes was Hard Rock and lame. An exception was playing some noisy wall of guitar sound for ages at the end of a song, just like MY BLOODY VALENTINE or THE WEDDING PRESENT. That was fun to play.
Actually at that time lots of it was sort of ideology. Short songs like in Punk music, also THE JESUS AND MARY CHAIN never played a concert longer than 30 minutes – and we liked that idea a lot. A while we only played 10 songs and whenever we had a new one, an old song had to go, so we always only played the best songs we had.

++ You moved to Budapest, right? Why was that? Didn’t you miss much being in the band?

I started studying directing and screenwriting at the film school in Budapest. I didn’t give up playing music, though. With two class mates from film school we formed a band called RADIATING HAPPINESS and I played solo as ELSEWHERE for quite a while. I had written tons of songs during that period, but never recorded anything which is a shame. I still regret that.

++ When and why did the band split? What did you all do after?

The split up is a sad part of the story and I think I rather not talk about it, especially because when we met for rehearsing for this one gig at the 10 year Marsh-Marigold festival, there was suddenly this guy singing the songs I had written and sung. After I had left the band, they had continued with a friend of Jens, singing and when we rehearsed I felt like I had to beg for singing my own songs. That was sad.

++ What do you think of Kristallin’s tribute song “The Legendary Bang”?

Great song, great band! I wish them all the best!!!

++ Is there any chance that the band will ever reform? Maybe even for a one off?

You never know, although I’d be quite surprised. If we might play again, I promise we play “Sound of love”!

++ On the Twee.net there is a Legendary Bang CDR listed as “Noisepop Helden aus Flethsee”, what was that about?

Flethsee is the hometown of Jens.

++ Are there any unreleased tracks of the band still? Have you ever thought of putting together some sort of retrospective compilation?

Jens is working on something, I suppose. But there are no unreleased tracks as far as I know.

++ What are you doing these days? Do you still play music? What other hobbies do you have?

I write screenplays for movies and television and direct commercials and movies. With Henning from DIE FÜNF FREUNDE and CAMPING we were thinking of recording a bossa nova version of a LEGENDARY BANG song, let’s see what comes out of it.
For my movies I like writing music or working closely with the composer on the soundtrack. I also still have a few songs that are waiting to be recorded once. Maybe with the new techniques like Garage Band. Let’s see 😉

++ One last question, and I need some suggestions here. I think I’m going to Hamburg later this year and I want to visit another cool town around and I already knew Lübeck. Is there any other nice town worth a visit around there?

Come to Berlin and we have beer together!

++ Thanks a lot Péter! It was great fun to interview you! Anything else you’d like to add?

These were a lot of questions. If I think of anything else, I write to you.

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Listen
The Legendary Bang – Sound of Love

Thanks so much to Steve Fanning for getting in touch and for the interview! Great Scott has been a band I’ve been trying to track down for so long since I fell in love with “You’re Off Again” years ago thanks to a mix CD a friend sent me. Later I was able to find the Hoopla tape reissue on vinyl and wrote a bit about the band on the blog. Happily there are many more songs, some which I’ve heard already and they are truly fantastic! Hopefully there will be more news about an upcoming release soon!  For now, enjoy the interview!

++ Hi Steve! Thanks so much for being up to this interview! How are you doing?

I am doing very well thank you. Nice to hear from you once again.

++ The information about Great Scott on the web is almost nonexistent. So let’s start from the beginning, you were based in Brighton, right? was Great Scott your first band?

Great Scott was a band, formed and based in Brighton.

++ How did the band start? Who were the members? How did you all new each other?

It comprised of Howard Bathos, Claire Bower, Steve Fanning, Bill Cox of How Many Beans Make Five, the Popguns and The 14 Iced Bears fame on Drums and our Bass Player, Jake. A previous member, Neil Jones, was on Bass prior to me, Steve Fanning, on vocals and guitar, joining along with my Bass Player from another, Jake.

All of us, including How Many Beans Make Five and the Popguns lived in various shared houses together around this period, i.e. 1987-1992. We all knew each other from college or just the social scene in which we were involved.

++ Why the name Great Scott?

The name Great Scott I believe was penned by Howard Bathos, as a sort of very English exclamation.

++ Did you gig a lot? Do you remember any gigs in particular? Where was the furthest you played from Brighton?

Unfortunately, we did not that many Gigs, probably between five and six Gigs. Two of which were at the old Escape Club in Brighton, which was then known as the Apple Orchard’s, supporting the Chesterfields and the Brilliant Corners. We then did to Gigs supporting How Many Beans Make Five, one in Horsham, at a Club called Champagnes and another at Ilkley College in Yorkshire.

Claire and I also did a Charity Gig for Brighton Housing Trust as a two piece, backed up by two work colleagues/

++ The first song I ever heard from you was the trumpet-licious “You’re Off Again” on the Hoopla reissue on vinyl. How did all those trumpet lines came about? And if you don’t mind, care telling me the story behind the song?

The Trumpet’licious ‘You’re Off Again’ was put onto the Hoopla Tape, which was organised of Grant Lyons of La De Da Records.

Claire is responsible for the lovely Trumpet tones, just as she is on ‘The Very Best Part’.

++ The Hoopla tape was originally released by La Di Da, perhaps the most important Brighton label at the time. How do you remember the scene around it during those years? You know, How Many Beans Make Five, John Cunningham, Grant’s Kitchen?

The scene at that time, and in particular those bands on the Hoopla Tape, including John Cunningham, with whom I actually did a great deal of backing singing on his solo albums, during the 90’s, was typical of all the bands knowing each other and playing in the same venues, as well as drinking in the same haunts.

I did actually attend a coupled of Gigs in Grant’s Kitchen, most notably the How Many Beans Make Five, in or around 1986/1987. They were legendary.

++ The second song I heard from you was  “The Very Best Part”. How did that one ended on the Kite tape? Do you remember who made it? Are there any anecdotes behind this song?

‘The Very Best Part’ was a song that I wrote reflecting back on a relationship that had ended a year or so previously and I presented it to the band, which thankfully liked it too and agreed to record it to be on the Kite tape compilation. This was produced and engineered by Grant Lyons of La De Da Records, as of Hoopla Fame.

++ Lately I’ve heard four more songs of yours, how many songs did you recorded? Care listing them? And which one is your favourite?

Unfortunately, we did not do a great deal of recording, although there was a whole stack of songs waiting to be recorded, some of which I have recorded subsequently and some of which I did actually play in fledgling bands with John Cunningham, although we never unfortunately got much further out of the Studio.

I suppose by favourite is ‘The Very Best Part’ and ‘Another Part of Town’. ‘Another Part of Town’ was one of the very first songs I wrote, really inspired by a kind of Buddy Holly feel as you can probably hear.

Unfortunately, it didn’t offer anything back in the day as we really didn’t push ourselves. I suppose we were all pursuing other avenues and it is only when I look back that I wish we had concentrated more, and at least for prosperity, or our own satisfaction, recorded more than we did.

++ Why didn’t you get to release anything back in the day? Weren’t there any offers?

I don’t believe we received any offers, but then again, as I say, we did not really put ourselves about as we should have done.

++ So when and why did you split? You moved to the States after, right?

The split really just happened. I went to live in the States, when I actually returned a Year later, to a house that I was then sharing with the ‘Beans’, they all moved over to the States, but unfortunately I never reformed the band with Claire. By that time, the other band members had actually gone and of course we lost our drummer in Bill, when he went to the States with the rest of the ‘Beans’.

++ What was your favourite thing about San Francisco? Any favourite places there? Do you think live int he US is very different to the one in UK?

Living in San Francisco was absolutely brilliant. It is very similar to Brighton insofar as it is quite bohemian and multicultural place with a great laid-backed attitude and not dissimilar in its architecture and social scene.

++ What are you doing nowadays?

These days, I am a Solicitor in Brighton. I have a small practice together with another person who deals in Immigration Law, and I do mainly Family and general Litigation.

I spend most of the Summer doing as many of the Festivals as possible. I am very fortunate that a friend of mine, who runs a Marquee Company, very kindly ensures that I get to go along to as many as possible.

++ What would you say, looking back, was your highlight as Great Scott?

My highlight of Great Scott was probably the funny ol’trip we took up to Ilkley College. For some reason the promoter there, and his girlfriend, had booked How Many Beans and us as their support. When we arrived we discovered that it was Half-Term, that there was no one else on Campus apart from these two and the Janitor. We actually then did a Gig, which was mainly attended by lots of our friends who lived nearby, i.e. Manchester, and those who had come up for the road trip, only to then descend upon the promoters Halls of

Residence to spend the night.

They were quite naïve types and I am not quite sure that they knew what had hit them.

++ I may go to Brighton next month, I wouldn’t mind if you give me some tips on what to see, where to eat, in your town…

If you come to Brighton, which I very much invite you to do, then of course do look me up, then I would suggest picking up one of the Listings Magazines and you will find plenty to do Gig wise and any otherwise.

++ Thanks again a lot, anything else you’d like to add?

All I would like to add Roque is thank you very much for the kind words that you wrote about our Band and our songs. Keep enjoying your music.

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Listen

Great Scott – The Very Best Part

Thanks so much for Phil Paterson for the interview! A month ago I wrote about the great Scottish band Future World Moves. Happily Phil got in touch with me and was up for answering some questions! It’s a great read, and yes, if you are in Scotland, you have to try haggis, neeps and tatties, I look forward to some of that next Monday in Glasgow! Enjoy!

++ Hi Phil! How are you? Any exciting plans for this summer?

I am planning a trip with my wife to the north of Scotland this august to Applecross for two weeks. Ahh peace and quiet!

++ So you’ve always been based in Livingston, right? Was there any music scene there at all? Any bands that you’d recommend from when you were around?

In the early 80’s and 90’s we were based in Livi. There was a music scene then but it was predominantly punk or heavy metal, of which we were neither. This was never a problem for us as we all drew our influences from both sources and drew an audience from both genres.

The bands that I could recommend would be punk bands like, the Skrotees, Bayoneting Babies or Goodbye Mr Mackenzie who were from just outside Livingston in a place called Bathgate. The later of which the backing singer/keyboard player went on to front Garbage.

++ I saw that Livingston is kind of in the middle of Glasgow and Edinburgh. What are the advantages of that? Music-wise and living there?

Being stuck in the middle between the two cities meant we did not really suffer from the long standing rivalry between the two. We could easily go to either city and be warmly welcomed. Livingston after all was a major overspill from Glasgow in the late 60’s to mid 70’s.

++ Let’s talk about the band. First and foremost, what came first the song Future World Moves or the name of the band? Where did you get that phrase from?

I believe the band name came first but don’t quote me on that after all it has been a few years down the line and my memory may not be quite as sharp as it once was, ok, so its isn’t as sharp as it once was. The first name I can remember us having for the band was Suspended Moves. But this may have came from the merger of FWM (Bren and Gerry) with (Bob and myself). In the very early stages of the band one of our first songs was named Future Moves, I can only take it that it came from the creative mind of Gerry or Bren.

++ So was this your first band? Who were the members and how did you knew each other?

This was our first attempt at a real band, previous to that Bob and I were learning how to play, whereas Gerry and Bren previously had a school band together. We were very fortunate that we all grew up together so we were friends long before we were band members. This stood us in good stead. It meant we had by passed the teething problems that most young bands go through after being together for a few years. I have known Bob since I was 7years old, Gerry since he was 3years old Bren since I was 19years old and Alex was a later addition for me but knew the rest of the guys from school.

++ Did you really were around 1981 to 1991?

Yeah i guess we were around for that length of time although it never felt long to us. I can only attribute that to us being friends first.

++ You were telling me you were more of a live band than a studio band. So what would you say were your three best gigs, and why?

We loved playing live. We had a powerful sound live of which we never really managed to capture in the studio environment. The studio did help to fine tune our playing and writing skills but you could not beat that live raw emotive sound that we produced.

++ I hear some Chameleons in your tracks, could it be? Who would you say influenced your sound?

Funnily enough I don’t believe any of us had ever listened to the Chameleons. It was one I had to check out when you made the comment. I could see where you were coming from. Our influences have been so varied. Reggie, Punk, Classical, Heavy Metal, you name it we would listen to it. I must admit though I was huge Clash fan and still am. Great music never really fades away.

++ So only one release, the 12″, right? There seems to be a bunch of unreleased tracks though. What happened? Why didn’t you get to release more records?

We were in the studio a few times before we decided to release the mini album in 1988. Anytime we could all club together to make a recording then we would do. But to create the album was another story. Firstly the cost was beyond us and secondly we had no management or record company that showed any interest at the time. So it was an exercise in business for us to release the album under our own label and do all the foot work ourselves. With the help of a local financial backer and distribution company we managed to record, print and distribute 1000 albums only as a limited edition. So trying to get one now is almost impossible. Saying that I found a record shop in Tokyo, Japan selling obscure vinyl records. Low and behold they had our album for sale. None of us have any idea how it managed to make its was to Tokyo 23 years later. Well, I guessed I could have walked quicker.

++ Let’s talk about the release. It is wonderful! I think my favourite song is “This Particular Day”. Would you care telling me the story behind this song?

This Particular Day is a song about waking up in the Scottish highlands listening to the crashing waves of the sea on the shore and being completely overawed by the splendour of the Scottish landscape. Leaving you with a feeling that anything in life is possible.

++ And what about your favourite song on it?

My personal favourite is ‘Its Time’. We were always very political in our content and this song just said it all for me. It was also the most unusual chord sequence that I had ever played thanks to Gerry (chord master) McCart. But my favourite songs never made it to the album, but that’s a story for another time.

++ And what about that photo on the cover? Where was it taken?

The photograph was take by myself, hence the reason for my absence. But I manage to get my face on the back cover. It was taken in the doorway of an old street in Edinburgh called Niddry Street just of the Royal Mile. These were underground living quarters over a hundred years ago possibly two, where people would literally live under the streets in the pitch blackness and dampness. It was used at the time of the photograph as practice rooms. It was so dangerous to practice there because of the dampness. For example, I can remember us all being in there in the dark and damp standing on wooden crates so as not to be electrocuted with the 6inches of water on the floor. Crazy times.

++ Looking back, how do you remember those late 80s? It feels it was the heyday of guitar pop, you agree? What were your highlights being on Future World Moves?

I loved the 80’s. The music was just on the turn again with the new wave and new romantics, none of which really moved us. Punk gave us the inspiration to play anything we wanted. We felt that we didn’t need to fit into a certain genre or pigeon hole. I would say there are to many highlights to name them all but first and foremost having the opportunity to grow with your mates and have a great time creating music did it for me.

++ Why did you split? Are you all still in touch? What do you do these days?

Its difficult to say exactly why we split. I’m sure there were many reasons. Personally, I had a young family to take care of and had to concentrate my efforts to make some cash. We have never stopped being in touch even though Bob(the bass) now lives in the land of Oz. The rest of us still play together in some form or other.

++ You are now in a cover band called “We’re Not Iguanas”, care to tell me a bit about that?

WNI was formed to have a bit of fun as a collective between quite a few musicians. We wanted to just gig but do it locally and consistently playing songs we loved from our past. So Were Not Iguanas was born.

++  And what about original music? Are you still making any? I’d love to hear!

We are still creating original music albeit a little slower than in the past. As you said in a comment on your blog, Life does get in the way.

Its not something I thing we could easily give up. Its in our blood.

++ As you are Scottish, I must ask, do you know how to make a good haggis, neeps and tatties? What would be your favourite Scottish food?

With due care and attention, and definitely not in the nude! My favourite Scottish food is Haggis Neeps and Tatties funny enough.

++ One last question, why does Scotland always produce great music?

What can I say? We are just very talented creative people. I guess if you suppress something (people) long enough eventually something has to pop. And so I guess we are lucky it comes out in a creative manner and not any other way.

++ Thanks again so much, anything else you’d like to add?

I would just like to say many thanks to yourself for this opportunity to chat about the album and band Future World Moves. Its been a while. Rock on Roque, keep up the great work.

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Listen
Future World Moves – This Particular Day

Thanks so much to Chris Lewington for the interview! I had written about the amazing Bicycle Thieves on the blog some months ago and I was lucky that some days ago Chris got in touch and filled in the gaps! Ghostdance is one of the best songs I’ve discovered this year, and now after reading this interview, I like it much more. Enjoy!

++ So The Bicycle Thieves… was it your first band? How did the band start? How did the recruiting process work?

The band was my third proper band. There’s a sort of thin line of progression of band members through my other bands. I was first with The Silence a sort of new Psychedellic band around 1981/2. There was a bit of a scene in London then of bands doing late 60’s psychedellic influenced stuff and we drew quite a lot from American 60’s bands like Love and the Byrds. Theres a compilation album called Splash of Colour of bands of that time that The Silence have a track on. The Silence morphed into The Habit, a bit more Gothie type of thing and that in turn became the Bicycle Thieves around 1985 with myself, Steve Penfold the drummer from the Habit and Graham Robson bass and Alisdair Nelson guitar recruited from adverts in the music press.This was the line up that recorded Louise/Ghostdance. Later on Dave Goode replaced Graham and Mark Burdett replaced Alisdair when he went back to New Zealand. Plus a sax player Ian Derbyshire and this line up recorded Waterfront.

++ Where were you based? And why the name?

We were based around south east London Deptford area as that’s where most of us were living at the time and its always been one of those areas in London that has a vibrant music scene going. I’ve always been a bit of a film buff, in fact I came to London to college at film school at the LCP.So I fancied the name of the Italian film as quite a poetic name for a band. So have several other groups through the years it would seem.

++ Did you gig a lot? Are there any particular gigs you remember?

We gigged mostly around London. Later on we went further afield and did gigs up and down England. Only ever gigged once abroad at a festival in Po in France which was one of the more memorable gigs. Gigs at the Marquee in London were always special because of the places association with all the classic bands that have played there.

++ Were there any bands that you enjoyed the most to play with at gigs? And how close did you feel to the guitar pop scene, the so called c86, that had just exploded in the UK?

I can’t say I was particularly aware of any c86 scene at the time. I was mostly influenced by American west coast bands from the 60’s and more singer songwriter stuff and then when people like REM, Lloyd Cole, maybe the Postcard bands came along they had something in common. Alasdair the guitarist was a fan of early REM and added that essential jangly guitar sound. Later on Alisdair left and his replacement Mark Burdett was a fan of the Australian band The Church so later stuff like Waterfront has that sort of feel to it. We played with all sorts of other bands from Stiff Little Fingers to Captain Sensible.

++ Who were behind the Sun Zoom Spark label? Was there any major label interest?

Sun Zoom Spark and Clearspot were both our own labels. Both had a Cpt Beefheart link in the name. That came from Steve the drummer. Waterfront gained a lot of major label interest because we were getting it played on daytime BBC radio 1 and in those days there wasn’t the huge variety of radio stations that you have now. Apart from Capitol if you were listening to pop or rock radio it was going to be Radio 1. So for a brief point in time it created a stir because we were basically an indie band that had gatecrashed the majors party. We did a distribution deal and got a management company with the idea of keeping control over what we recorded and put out but now having the finance to do it on the back of this. But we were basically overtaken by events. It was 1989 and the Manchester Stone Roses/Happy Mondays thing started to happen. We kind of quickly became yesterdays news as everyone’s attention was focused on bands up north with more dance cross over rhythms.

++ Let’s talk about the releases! I’ve only got the Waterfront 12″ which is really nice. Care to tell me about the recording process for this one? And what about the photo on the cover? I find it very evoking!

Waterfront was recorded over a couple of days at Greyhound studios in Fulham. I’d written the song about all the redevelopment over in the docklands area of east London where I was living. The photo was one we found when we went to the docklands archive. As you say it was a very evocative photo. Don’t know who it is or who took it but it was taken in the past when the area was still dockyards and kind of evoked that sense of loss that the song was about.

++ I do have to say I enjoy the Ghostdance 7″ even though I still haven’t had the chance to find it. I find “Ghostdance” to be an underrated guitar pop classic! I was wondering if you could tell me the story behind the song? What’s the Ghostdance? 😉

Ghostdance started off with some guitar ideas that Alisdair had and we kind of worked on them and I came up with a top line melody and we fashioned it into the song. We didn’t write a lot of songs together and that was a shame because when we did get down to co writing we came up with some good stuff. I know on your blog you’ve mentioned about the Native Americans story of the Ghostdance and I was aware of that at the time but really I was using the phrase more in terms of memory. It was a song about evoking and reminiscing so its the sort of dance of the ghosts of your memories type of thing.

++ And what about “Louise”? Was it based on a real Louise?

Louise was kind of inspired by a couple of relationships neither called Louise though. I kind of think of it as Bruce Springsteen meets Wuthering Hights.

++ So that was your whole discography? 2 releases? or maybe there were compilation tracks? Are there unreleased songs maybe?

There were just the two single releases Ghostdance/Louise in 86 and Waterfront in 89. The large gap between the two due to the collapse of the original band and getting the right people on board again for Bicycle Thieves mark 2. Dave and Ian who joined the band in about 88 saw us play our last gig at Queen Marys with the old line up. Mark the next guitarist was again a music press advert. Yeah there’s lots of unreleased songs. We had more than an albums worth of demos from around Waterfront time most of which are probably better quality recordings. We also re recorded Louise with Tony Visconti producing around that time.

++ I read that both your records received a good amount of National Radio airplay. Maybe you got played even by John Peel? How hard was it back then to get your music heard? In pre-internet times?

Getting you music heard was hard back then because there were few radio stations and the only one that really counted was radio 1. We were very in house. I was ringing up the radio producers and doing all the plugging. Ghostdance got plays with Janice Long on evening radio 1 and Waterfont got much more extensive radio play on Capitol and daytime radio 1. Mike Read of all people really like it and picked up on it and Tommy Vance played it a lot. John Peel was not a fan unfortunately.

++ Looking back in time, what would you say was the biggest highlight of The Bicycle Thieves?

The biggest high ight for me was definitely hearing Waterfront played for the first time on afternoon radio 1. I’d managed to get through to the producer of the show who said they might play it and then hearing it was just a great release of years of pent up hopes and frustration trying to get your music heard. There it was and you knew that another 20 million odd people up and down the country were hearing it too.

++ So what happened, why did you split up?

We split up in 1990 for the simple reason that we couldn’t get a record deal. We’d done a lot off our own back but in the end you need the finance to keep making records and at that time you needed a major record label. There’s been times in pops history where I think you could do it truly independently like in 76/77 but 89/90 wasn’t one of them and any ” indie ” labels at that time were usually backed by major money.

++ Have you been involved with music since?

My next band after the Bicycle Thieves was a folk type set up “The Famous Blue Raincoats” but we never ended up putting any singles out. After that I just did songwriting. I currently play live with a covers band still with the old Bicycle Thieves drummer Steve. We’re called Kings of Oblivion – another name used by umpteen other different bands.

++ What did The Bicycle Thieves consider themselves? Indiepop? Pop? Punk? Rock?

I guess I’d call the Bicycle Thieves indie. Indie is kind of as much about how you do things and put your music out and for the most part we were truly indie in that sense. As a sound we might have strayed a bit to much into mainstream rock maybe. I don’t know. People like the NME and John Peel ignored us maybe because our sound wasn’t indie enough but you know you make the music that you make. Others tell you what niche you fit into or don’t fit into.

++ One last question, well, two, as Im always curious about this with British people. Do you like Marmite? And, do you prefer a lager or a British ale?

I do like marmite. Better than vegemite. I usually use it in cooking to enhance the flavour of spinach with pasta. I drink beer and no its not warm its just not served ice cold like American beer. Lager is what they drink in Europe. Nothing beats a nice cool pint of foaming Old weassels testicle

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Listen
The Bicycle Thieves – Ghostdance