Thanks so much to Pete, Hutch, Mark and Michelle, all four members of The Speedpuppies, for this great interview! They just released on this label (Cloudberry of course!) a retrospective CD that includes their 5 recorded songs and they are so fantastic! The Speedpuppies were a short-lived band from Stoke-on-Trent on the late eighties, and many may know that Pete went to be part of The Rosehips and he is nowadays half of the fantastic duo Horowitz! If you want to listen some more tunes, drop by their myspace!

++How is Stoke this winter? Are you getting ready for Christmas?

Hutch: I’m no longer in Stoke but I was there for last Christmas and loved it. Sub zero temperatures and a warm welcome in the pubs.

Pete: It’s getting colder by the day and there aren’t many leaves left on the trees that grow amid the urban destruction that passes for redevelopment. I’ll be stocking the fridge with beer and checking pub opening times ready for the Christmas break.

Mark: It’s cold and I’m almost done shopping which is a first.

++ How did you all knew each other? How do you remember Stoke’s scene back then?

Hutch: I met Pete through mutual friends probably at one of the local indie nights, or maybe even at the Wayfarer which was this cheesy pub disco in Stone where I lived. We regularly bumped into each other at various gigs. Michelle’s sister was at school with my sister and we probably knew each other through mutual friends around Stone.

Mark: I knew Pete from The Rosehips days and got introduced to Hutch & Michelle through him.

Michelle: I can’t remember how we got together – maybe in the local pub, through friends of friends – but I’m not sure. I do remember practicing at Hutch’s parents’ house and we occasionally used some practice studios in Stoke. We played several gigs around Stoke and recorded the demo. I believe we had a break during the summer of 88, when I went to work on a camp in New York State. We had the gig at “The Zoo” when I came back.

Pete: Hutch, together with our mutual friend Ade Brightmore, started putting on an alternative non-goth nights at Parkers No. 7 in Stone. Back then, it was goth, goth, goth – that was THE alternative – but not at Parkers, where it was the Mary Chain, Primitives, Shop Assistants, Membranes, Age Of Chance et al. The Rosehips spurred me into thinking that I could actually be in a band, rather than just play guitar in my bedroom and that’s where the Speedpuppies began. We were a four piece originally, with Michelle on drums and Liz singing. It rehearsals, Liz in her stripey top and shades, looked like Alex Shop Assistant and really, I just hoped we could do something along Shop Assistant lines. Liz used to take gig photos of lots of 80s indiepop bands – someone should try to coax her to put them online! Anyway, maybe it was shyness or nerves but Liz couldn’t and wouldn’t sing in public and left the band, when we were offered our fist gig. Michelle moved to singing and took to it like a duck to water. Until Mark joined, we used my old Boss DR-110 drum machine at gigs. Without a drummer, we used to practice at Hutch’s parents house – Mrs Hutchinson used to bring us tea and cake in the middle of our practices! I already knew Mark from The Rosehips and when he saw us play with a drum machine, he offered to drum for us.

Before The Speedpuppies formed, I put an advert in the window of a local music shop, along the lines of “Guitarist seeks….influences – The Shop Assistants and Sex Pistols.” Naturally, some goth types answered! We had a few rehearsals in a student living room in Stoke. I borrowed a friend’s electric guitar, which had previously sounded great, but he’d sawn off the top part of the body, to make it look like the one that Pete Shelley used in the Buzzcocks. The guitar now sounded a pale imitation of its former self but nevertheless, we rehearsed Bowie’s Queen Bitch and a few other covers. Richard, who was the singer/non singer (it’s a long story, Roque!), became a good friend and acted as driver (and saviour) when I had to get from Stoke to Plymouth and back in one night to play a Rosehips gig.

++ Which other bands from Stoke you liked?

Hutch: The Rosehips were excellent. There was also a band called Exit Condition who were a three piece with what sounded to me like an early Husker Du.

Pete: There were some great bands in Stoke around that time. The Sainsburys are one of the great long lost indiepop bands. Someone should force Dave Wood to locate the master tapes and get the tracks heard! In fact, I might have another go myself! They were brilliant. Ant and later, Mark from the Sainsburys, were also in The Rosehips. Vicarage Gardens were excellent, like an early REM. Honeycrash were a shambolically and heroically fun and funny live band and made one ace single; The Anythings were a cool Velvets influenced band but they seemed to disappear! We used to go and see Flame On! and Exit Condition who were ferocious bands, very much influenced by 80s American hardcore.

Mark: The punk ones mainly – Adversary, Exit Condition, Reverse – it was quite a close-knit community

++ Why did you decide to change the band name from The Safe Boys to The Speedpuppies?

Mark: You’ll have to ask the others. I just hit the tins at the back.

Hutch: The Safe Boys came from first line of the song Poison of Passion. I’ve always thought coming up with band names is a hundred times harder than actually writing the songs. The name goes on the posters and the record covers. It carries all the power. It should stick with people whether they hear the music or not -whether they like the music or not. Plus finding a name that everyone in the band agrees with is tough. I think we just came to the decision that the Speedpuppies was a better name.

Pete: We couldn’t agree on a name for a long time and it was only when we had our first gig that we had to come up with one – The Safe Boys. I don’t think any of us were ever 100% happy with it but we’d rejected The Night Porters and others and we were desperate! The 1988 live tape was recorded at Hudson’s nightclub (Alan Hudson of Stoke City, Chelsea and England fame!) when we were The Safe Boys.

++ I think the Speedpuppies is a great name! But how did you come up with such a name?

Hutch: It was, I believe, one of Flame On! who came up with the name for themselves (and possibly had rejected it). Ant Rosehip told us about it and I think we grabbed it before somebody else got in there. It’s cheekily ambiguous.

Pete: Yes, it was Flame On! On the day we recorded the demo, we were the Speedpuppies, although the name on the master cassette says Doreen Slater and the Speedpuppies. Glenn Rosehip popped into the recording session and, at the end of the session, persuaded us that Doreen Slater and the Speedpuppies was a vast improvement. Caught up in the moment, we thought it was great and used it on the cover of the cassette but in the cold light of day, it didn’t really suit us, so we shortened it back very quickly! I don’t think Michelle felt comfortable with people thinking she might be Doreen Slater!

++ What about the demo you recorded? There was no interest from labels at that time? It’s strange as it is so good!

Hutch: To be honest we were all pretty new to this and wouldn’t have had a clue how to market ourselves effectively. That said, Pete may have sent it out to a few labels. At this time there were hundreds of bands all over the country. You had to be something pretty special to get industry types to travel out from one of the bigger cities.

Pete: I sent about half a dozen out to “indiepop” labels – sorry Hutch and Michelle; it’s my fault that we never got into the hands of the industry AR men! I sent cassettes to Sarah, Subway, Raving Pop Blast, Sowing Seeds and 53rd and 3rd. Sarah replied to say no thanks, but apart from that, we had no response.

++ How did the songwriting process worked for the band? Did you have more songs that never got the chance to be recorded?

Hutch: I’m sure we had a few other songs. There was certainly a cracking cover of Dolly Parton’s 9 to 5. Michelle liked Dolly and insisted on doing the track and coerced us. I’d thought that C&W was crappy but we really punked it up well and it probably could have been a great single. Everyone cheered when we played it live. The songwriting was usually each of us getting bold enough to bring out little bits of melodies and lyrics and stitching them together. There may have been a few where an individual had a full song and then the rest of us added little bits here and there – like spice to a curry. Before we came to remaster these songs I’d have had a problem remembering much about them. As soon as I heard them little bits do leap out. The Killing Time was definitely Pete’s lyric. I can remember writing elements of Poison of Passion because it was during the initial Aids/HIV hysteria and it was meant to be describing some dystopian love tryst. I think that a few of us were exorcising the demons of failed relationships in those words. Half a Chance has some nasty sentiments. I cringe when I listen to some of those lines. I suspect that there were many more songs that, given time would have surfaced from each of us. Pete would have had several dusty notebooks tucked away within his guitar case. There was still much shyness to overcome before we could confidently express ourselves in front of each other.

Pete: The Dolly Parton cover was one that we used to hammer out. I came up with The Killing Time and part of Poison of Passion and I remember Hutch teaching us Half A Chance. There were a few more that we used to play – The Man You Left Behind, Obvious Clue and The Morning After, which are on a live recording from 1988. There may be a few more half finished ones on the 4 track cassettes.

Michelle: I only wrote one song as far as I can remember “You’ll Never Know” – glad it made it onto the demo tho ; )

++ Which is your favourite song of yours? why?

Hutch: I like Serenade because the arrangements seem the most advanced. Michelle does some great overdubbed vocals and we really got that lift when the chorus kicks in. There’s a nice little guitar riff that I think Pete came up with in the studio at Rugeley.

Pete: At the time, The Killing Time was my favourite. Michelle kept the backing vocals to herself and the first we knew about them was in the studio singing them! Now it’s probably You’ll Never Know or Serenade.

Mark: The Killing Time

++ You played around six gigs in about a year and a half, which is the gig you remember the most and why?

Hutch: We did one of the first in a club up at Newcastle (Under Lyme) when we still had the drum machine and it was a pain in the arse to get the right song going on it. Newcastle had quite a hipster crowd and I can remember feeling nauseous I was so nervous. Michelle suddenly became brilliantly confident in front of an audience. It was very shambolic but I think we made our mark. Somebody chalked some graffiti about us (or Michelle) on one of the underpass walls in town and to me that was a worthy accolade.

Pete: The one at Hudson’s when we were The Safe Boys, was great. Just the feeling of standing in front of a loud guitar amp was a blast! The Rosehips played as well and there was lots of paper confetti around from the travelling Fat Tulips.

++ After the Speedpuppies were over, Mark continued on a band called Flame On! I don’t think I’ve heard about this band, I guess they were fans of The Human Torch? Care to tell me a bit more about it?

Mark: They were a punk band already going. They had a great double bass drum drummer called Rob who used to play in cowboy boots and a guy called Clive on bass! The first band I was in featured Mark & Simon from Flame On! so when Rob and Clive left, Mark shifted across to bass and I jumped in on the kit.

Pete: Flame On! were very much influenced by American hardcore. They used to rehearse every week and seemed to have a batch of new songs for every gig! Mark’s drumming for the Speedpuppies was fantastic and we played together a few years later in Jack In The Green.

Hutch: Mark’s drumming was inspirational. When I heard those tracks again it was the first thing that stood out. You stick it behind a few fledgling tunes and suddenly you have raw adrenalin coursing through them. I think Flame On! got their name from a Birthday Party tune. I can’t remember their tunes too well but they were much heavier than us.

++ What happened with Hutch and Michelle? Were they involved with any other bands after?

Michelle: I still love music but my singing is mostly reserved for bath times, which is probably a good thing!!!! Some of my family still live in Stone which is where we all met, and I go back there a couple of times a year.

Hutch: I’ve been in a few bands over in Sydney but have never released any tunes. I’m one of those blokes that often get credits on CDs for lending the band my amp or something J . I DJ’d (mainly soul music) on BondiFm for a year. I’m not currently playing in any bands but I don’t feel that I’ve yet reached the end of my musical journey – whatever the vehicle may be.

++ Are you The Speedpuppies still in touch? What are you doing nowadays?

Hutch: This project has brought us back in contact. I live in Sydney and travel back infrequently but I hope we all get chance to catch up for a beer when I’m next in England.

Michelle: After “The Speedpuppies” I went off to Manchester University to train to be an Art Teacher, played quite a lot of Volleyball, and tried my hand at DJ ing for a while. I am now living in Oxfordshire, and run a Creative Arts Faculty at a Secondary School in Wiltshire.

Pete: I play in Horowitz and record friends’ bands. The Pete Green and the Corporate Juggernaut LP is partly recorded and is sounding ace. Darren and Caroline from The Blanche Hudson Weekend (ex-Manhattan Love Suicides) recorded 5 tracks here and I’m chuffed to high heaven to have played on a couple of them – they’re fantastic; I’ve been helping out Falling and Laughing, who incorporate elements of indiepop, post-rock and Sonic Youth type guitar noise – Oddbox Records are putting out their single/ep in the new year. And there’s a new Horowitz LP and a few singles to be recorded too!

++ Going back to the Christmas subject, ask Santa for a gift!

Hutch: Stoke City to beat Manchester City 0-4 on Boxing Day. Video footage of Gallagher brothers crying in their seats.

Mark: A time machine.

Pete: I’d be mightily thrilled with a copy of The Electric Pop Group’s new LP.

Michelle: The winning lotto ticket please!

++ Thanks so much for the interview! Anything you’d like to add?

Pete: Thanks so much for the release! It’s brought back great memories and, it’s put us back in touch again after all this time.

Hutch: Of the four people on that record I’m the only one who isn’t teaching in some shape or form. How did that happen and what does it say about my ability to communicate?

Michelle: It’s been great bringing The Speedpuppies back to life – even if it has been a virtual reunion so far. It’s a really good feeling to have the CD released after 25 years – cheers.

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Listen
The Speedpuppies – The Killing Time

Thanks to Peter Stone, by way of Neil Edmunds, for telling me a bit about The Sweetest Ache. I guess it makes sense he didn’t know the answer to some of my most curious questions! I’ll have to bug Simon about them. For now please check Peter and Neil’s new band The Milestone Band.

++ Hi there! Thanks so much for doing this interview! It’s hard to keep it short for blog standards as there is so so so much to cover about The Sweetest Ache! I guess I’ll take the chance to ask what seems to be the most mysterious things about the band! Though I’d love to do a second interview. But let’s rewind. Let’s go to the 80s. The Sweetest Ache started as The Spirals. Why did you change names? Care to tell me a bit about those early days? Are there any recordings from The Spirals by the way?

You would have to ask Simon Court about the Spirals sorry.

++ How did you all knew each other? How did the band come together?

Simon, Dave and Stu were in school together. Jimmy (Geraint Morriss) came for an audition as a drummer and got the job, and Peter was jamming with another band when Stuart asked him to join The Sweetest Ache.

++ Who came up with such a good name: The Sweetest Ache? Where did the inspiration came?

You will have to ask Simon on that one, but there is some truth in it.

++ Most people remember your releases on Sarah Records, so that’s a must-do question. How did you end up signing to the Bristol label? How was your relationship with Matt and Clare?

We made a demo tape in the flat Stuart was living in and sent it to Sarah and they signed us, we then went down the beach to celebrate…

++ It’s said that Simon said once he was a former member of Inspiral Carpets, how true is this?

Sorry again… I will ask him as I see him sometimes around.

++ How was the Swansea scene back then? Did you like any other bands from town? What were your favourite spots there?

Swansea was ok, but not as cool as Cardiff. We had lots of metal and punk bands as i recall, the underground dance scene was kicking off and we came then and totally shocked everyone with our mellow sounds at first.

++ On “Briaris”, one of your fans’ favourite songs, there’s a girl singing. Who is she? And how did you decide female vocals for it? And what does “Briaris” mean?

The girl was called Louise and she was Stu’s friends Nathan’s girlfriend and she had a stunning voice so we asked her to sing…there are a few other songs with her on, but unreleased., and the title was named after Phil Briaris another friend of the band..

++ And now I do have to ask you about my favourite song: “If I Could Shine”. Any story behind it?

The best song of the 90s, Simon and Stu wrote it. We recorded it in Vons studio in London and were late as our van caught fire on the way up, but what a song…

++ Also I’m very curious about why you called one of your songs and first album as Jaguar, why was that?

Pass. Sorry there was a reason but it escapes me. I’m sure Simon or Stu would know…

++ You will later release on what was considered the American Sarah, Sunday Records. But on this single “A New Beginning”, your music had changed quite a lot! What had happened in between? Maybe it was really a new beginning? Where did the jangly guitars go?

We had done all these mellow songs and slowly started listening to Neil Young, Bob Dylan and harder rock. So we just evolved into a heavier direction.

++ And the album that came next, was Grass Roots on Vinyl Japan? How did you end up signing for the English-Japanese label? And is it true that this record sold 10 thousand copies?!

++ So why didn’t you get to be more popular?!

The new album came out very overproduced and polished and the raw sound we had started with in the recording studio was ruined. And i think it sounded too soft rockish and people lost interest. We then reformed under the name of Freedom and made about 7 songs with a great dirty rock sound and we went down well. We then go back together as The Sweetest Ache and started making a 3rd album, but we never finished it due to band commitments, oh well…

++ Looking back in time what was the biggest highlight of The Sweetest Ache?

Playing in the underworld in Camden, London. And playing in the Sarah events. We were a bit naughty but we loved going on tour.

++ Why and when did you call it a day? What do you all do nowadays aside from making music?

Simon, Stretch  and Stu are in Shooter. Jimmy and Dave are in France playing. I’m not sure about the others but me, Rob and Neil are in The Milestone Band.

++ So one final question for now, can you make laverbread? Do you have your own recipe maybe?

Get some seaweed, clean it, cook it with butter and eat up.

++ Thanks again! anything else you’d like to add?

One day I’m hoping to get the original band back together to tour.

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Listen
The Sweetest Ache – If I Could Shine

Thanks so much to Geoff Suggett for the great interview! It’s brilliant to at last know more about The Lavender Faction!

++ Hi Geoff! Thanks for the interview! So let’s start from the beginning, you were first involved with Bulldozer Clarts right? Was that your first band? And then you left and started the Lavender Faction? Why did you take this decision?

Well actually The Lavender Faction was the third band after “XeX” and Eating Crow.

XeX were post punk and sort of a bit like early Cure and Joy Division recorded demo’s for EMI whose A&R rep Tony O’Conner was trying at the time to sign an unknown Manchester band called” The Smiths”, the history of The Smiths is well documented, XeX were promptly dropped like a hot turd. On the upside though I got to hear The Smiths before they signed to Rough Trade, “bonus”.

Bulldozer Clarts was a side project (to the already up and running Lavender Faction) that me and Stephen ( of This Almighty Pop!) started, he had a four track portastudio and as I was into the DIY ethic and decided to record some stuff together, I think we only recorded one song (”She Walked Away”). I still love that version of “She Walked Away” that we did on the four track.after that steve moved up a notch and got Mark in the band i was kicked out and resigned to being a lavy for the rest of the 80’s +early 90’s.

++ How did The Lavender Faction come together? Who were the bandmembers and how was the recruiting process?

Me and Rick were in a band called Eating crow who were a sort of Orange juice meets Echo and the Bunnymen with a bit of the Fall thrown in for good measure, we did some half decent tunes and once at a gig in Coventry were introduced to Roddy Radiation and Linval from the Specials they took us to a nightclub where we were told to fuck off by the doormen,and everyone went home, so close to fame yet so far away again, “ah well”!

After our brush with infamy rick and me left the band and formed the Lavender Faction who were: Andy Lee (drums), Marc Patterson (bass), Rick (guitars + voc), Geoff suggett (guitars + voc). Marc Patterson left to work as a journalist he was replaced by Richard miyers (bass)

The recruiting process:

As far as I can remember Rick knocked at my door one night and said “I’m leaving the band (Eating Crow) to form a band (The Lavender Faction) I want you to come and play guitar in the band and sing and write with me, that was just what i wanted so now i was in another band, we telephoned our friend Andy who had never been in a band but was a good drummer so now he was in the band, then we contacted a bass player we all knew called Jeff Macallum who also joined the band he was not punctual for rehearsals so he was out of the band I was friends with Marc Patterson he was a great bass player and joined the band.

++ Where does the name The Lavender Faction comes from?

The name comes from the idea that if we had something with a softer feel as in Lavender and something more edgy like faction and put together it seemed to create the feel we wanted to come through our music.

We were originally called The Angel Asylum we played our first gig under this name and then deemed it to be a bit heavy metal so The Lavender Faction it was.

++ Your first single, “Ride”,  is said to have influenced some guys to later name their band “Ride”! Do you know how true or false is this rumour?

This is a falsehood perpetrated by an unscrupulous type for the benefit of self promotion, namely me, after a serious acid session at Stephen Maughan’s bedsit, “what a night that was man”! I was telling Steve about my trip that had somehow traveled through Oxford where I met four guys who had a band and after watching our gig and buying a copy of the single decided to call their band Ride, well Steve was still on the comedown from the acid and believed the story to be true and wrote it up for the fanzine.

++ This single, as well as the other ones, were released on Lust Recordings, the new project of Stephen Woosh. Were you a usual at his Woosh club? How did you end up being signing to his new label?

To be honest at the time I wasn’t aware of the Woosh club ,only the fanzine which was always on sale in my favourite record shop “volume records” in Newcastle and other indie record shops in the city . I never even bought a copy. Then by chance I met Stephen (This Almighty Pop!) who told Steve Woosh about us and sent him a demo tape, Steve liked the songs and came to one of our gigs in Newcastle ,that night he asked us if we would like to release the first single on his new “Lust label” and shortly after that Woosh club became Lust club to which we became regulars whether it was playing gigs at the club or going to see other bands like Feral, The Keatons, The Sunflowers, St James Infirmary and getting off our face, the venue was the legendary but sadly no more Broken Doll .

++ He seems to have disappeared from the face of Earth, do you know where on Earth is he? Any anecdotes you can share about him or the Newcastle scene in general, like who were those people that were always at gigs? Or like the biggest Lavender Faction fans?

I haven’t seen Steve for about 4 years, it was at a Penetration (70’s punk band) gig out of town but we chatted for a good while about what we were both up too, he hasn’t changed much , still a snappy dresser in his white denim jacket and hoopy T-shirt although like me he is a little folically challenged these days but at least the mop top has gone or he would have resembled a Trappist monk, I think he said he was living with his partner, the girl from out of the Sunflowers and they have a child or children, and he works as a full time guitar tech, touring, ect, with major acts although I know he used to roady for My Bloody Valentine. I don’t know if he toured with them when they recently reformed .

++ What about the city in general, do you still live there? If so, has it changed a lot? What were the best venues back in the day for pop music?

Actually none of the band were from Newcastle, we all live about twenty miles south nearer to Durham city but we nearly always went to Newcastle to see bands or buy records, its still a great place for music, art, food etc, there is still a great scene but the venues have all changed, we had The Riverside which got most of the best acts its now a shit rave club, then there was the Mayfair suite, The Broken Doll, the Dog and parrot, The Bunker in Sunderland, etc etc, now there’s “Head of Steam” the Cluny or the Other rooms, not much else really.

++ The sound of the Lavender Faction is a mix of indiepop and shoegaze, what were you listening at that time?

When the band started I would think it was bands like The Wedding Present, The Marychain, Sonic Youth, Public Enemy, M.B.V, Buffalo Tom, Mazzy Star, Pixies, House of Love, Dinosaur Jr, Band of Suzans, Cocteau Twins, Loop, Wire , The Fall, Yellow, Del la soul, Stone Roses, Nwa, Nirvana, Babes in Toyland , Blue Nile , Neil Young , Bob Mould, Grant Heart, Throwing Muses, Spacemen 3, Husker Du, The Sundays, R.E.M, Ride, The Pale Saints, Primal Scream, Red House Painters, Lush , The Edsel Auctioneer, Drive, Swervedriver, Teenage Fanclub, Julian Cope, The Woodentops, St Etienne, Blue Aeroplanes, Chapterhouse , Slowdive, Leatherface, Midway Still, Mercury Rev, Flaming Lips , Spiritualized , The Field Mice, The Pooh Sticks, Stereolab , Curve, Felt,  Sugar, the Lemonheads, Ministry,  Juliana Hatfield, PJ Harvey, Pavement, Belly ,etc, etc, etc, etc.

I think that about covers a lot of it .

++ Your last single was the “Four Riffs for Joe” 12″. What are those four riffs and who is Joe?

Really the “Four Riffs” are the four songs on the 12″ and Joe was Joe Girvan our roady, Rick wanted to call it this as a thank you for Joe’s help while we were on tour with” The Wedding Present” so that was how that came about. .

++ What are your memories of recording all these records? I bet there were also many songs that were left unreleased, will there be any sort of retrospective album some day?

My memories of the recording sessions are mixed ,it was always a laugh and a pain in the arse at the same time.

Although we saw the band as a bit of a democracy the final decisions always came down to me and Rick but many an argument would arise over levels of one instrument or another but in general it was good times and hearing something that was self produced played on John Peel was the best feeling in the world. As far as the band having more material there were a few tracks that never made vinyl but nothing I can remember being outstanding and I don’t own any masters if there actually is one, I haven’t spoken to the other guys in the band for a while but Rick and Andy work together they might be planning a comeback for all i know but don’t hold your breath. No there aren’t any plans for a retrospective .

++ You also released a couple of flexis, the one with Stephen Maughan’s This Almighty Pop Fanzine that included the track Harbour Me, but there is another flexi that is not very well known, one shared with St. James Infirmary. That one had the song “Take Down the Walls”. Care to tell me a bit more about it?

Yeah! The original “Take Down the Walls” was a lot more melodic and we had recorded the tune at one session or another but rick decided he wanted to change the music and made it a lot harder sounding , we used the original lyrics with the new music and the magazine “Paint it Red” which was a free “What’s On” mag for the Newcastle arts scene asked Stephen Lust to provide tracks from bands on the label to go on a Flexi to be given away free with the mag, they did a spread on us and we were on the cover, I think I’ve got a couple tucked away in the attic, funny enough it was one of our favourite recordings by the band although i still prefer the original tune, its on one of our early demos.

++ Did you gig a lot with the band? Any gigs you remember the most?

We toured all over the UK and supported some great bands ,The Wedding Present, Buffalo Tom, Swervedriver, Carter USM , but the best gig of all had to be Liverpool Uni. We were supporting the Wedding Present and they said we could go second on the bill for that gig much to the disgust of the solo acoustic performer and vocalist and bass player in the Chameleons Mark Burgess. He didn’t speak to us after that but we went down a storm with the crowd great memories.

++ Why did you call it a day? What did you all do after?

The Lavender Faction ‘as most bands of the time before the internet’ had to rely on the press (Sounds , N.M.E and Melody Maker) radio airplay, fanzines, and you had to be prepared to gig constantly Rick unfortunately had no stomach for this and decided to call it a day .

Andy and me decided to move on and we formed Montana Hood who released one single.

++ Are you still making music nowadays? What other hobbies does Geoff Suggett has?

I still record stuff at home on my 16 track, and recently got Together with my old friend Stephen Maughan and reformed Kosmonaut for one gig to support White Town in Newcastle . Steve has kindly offered to release a track of my solo stuff “Neon Man” with a future release of his fanzine.

I snowboard when I can ,I walk a lot in the lake district and still get out to see the odd band or two when I can, oh and Ive recently taken up oil painting .

++ Thanks again, anything else you’d like to add?

Yeah! I would like to take this chance to say thanks to anyone who was a fan of the Lavender Faction , Thanks to you Roque for your interest in the band and especially thanks to Stephen Maughan who’s good friendship gave us the chance to do what we did .
ps. keep off the Acid Steve.

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Listen
The Lavender Faction – Ride

Thanks so much to Karl Moseley and Carl Bedward for the great interview about Where Garden Falls and bit of their previous band Leopold Bloom! Please check more songs by both of their bands on their myspace!

++ The band started after Leopold Bloom -which maybe should be another interview! -was over. What happened? Why did you decide to continue under a different name?

Karl: LB was a band in the purest sense; it relied on the input of four individals to create the sound of the band. However, it became quite obvious as time progressed that the band were increasingly falling back on mine and Carl’s songwriting skills. It was also very apparent that Carl was also doing all the background work for the band such as publicising the band, getting gigs, even ensuring that band members brought their equipment to rehearsals etc. It was also at this point, when we recorded a song called ‘The Convert’. This song was solely penned by Carl and myself as a songwriting duo. I think that this song is very much a hybrid of the LB and WGF sound, and so, together with Carl having to do all the logistical stuff as well, it felt like a good time to wind the band up. There ended LB.
It was very easy to make the transition from LB to WGF. Myself and Carl just reverted to a song writing partnership; I did all the lyrics and he did all the music. We did everything in our way and avoided all the egos etc that go with so called ‘democratic’ bands.

++ I had a German friend who for years asked me and asked me if I knew anything else from your band aside from what we’ve read from the Leamington Spa booklet. Now out of the blue you are on myspace! How did you decide to come to the social network nightmare? And how did you all knew each other?

Karl: WGF are/were just Carl and I. We enlisted help and we had some great musicians and friends to help us. You can see who they are on our MySpace profile.
As to how we came together, that’s not hard to explain, as Carl and I are cousins.
In terms of MySpace etc…someone told us that  there was an in-depth blog about LB penned by Stephen Davies (The Cudgels) that described a gig we played in West Bromwich (just outside of Birmingham). He said some very complimentary things about us and told us we still had an audience of sorts twenty years on. Incredible.

++ Where does the name Where Gardens Fall comes from?

Karl: The name WGF was the title of one of the first LB songs we ever wrote. I can remember a bit of the chorus…
‘Gardens fall without a sound,

I think I was about 16 at the time of writing that lyric/poem!

Carl: I remember a bloke who did a bit of 4 track recording with us commenting that the song sounded a little ‘Rolling Stones’ I was offended and subsequently we never recorded with him again!!! 

++ Why did you decide to self-release your Postcard 12″? And what about the Freak Out label? Why the name? and was this the only release?

Karl: With regard to ‘Postcard’ we did not  see the point of signing to a “little indie label” etc and as all the distribution networks (The then ‘nine mile & the cartel’ took on the distribution) were already in place, we just decided to do it ourselves. The ‘Freak Out’ label, well that was ours. Carl resurrected the label in 1998 for a release by a  band he was managing at the time called ‘Shamefaced’ for their debut single ‘Stereo Sister’(Cat No Freak 2 Postcard by WGF having been Freak 1)

++ I love the song “Search” that you included in the Sound of Leamington Spa compilation! It’s just the perfect mix of guitars, keyboards and passionate vocals. Care to tell me a bit more about this song?

Karl: Yeah, this is a very interesting song and links LB with WGF. The lyrics to the song are very ironic in  type, especially the last verses…
‘Books and records piled on shelves,
Discarded scenes from films
over-spill into my head,
Into everything we did and said…
And all I do is laugh along to the last abstract pop song’
After this song everything was written about charecters and not myself

Carl: I remember just messing around on the guitar one day with the intention of trying to play ‘Cemetary Gates’ by The Smiths and coming up with ‘Search’

++ “The Property Guide to Humanity” is such an intriguing title for a song. What does it mean? And what about the fantastic song that is “A Horse on Fire”?

Karl: ‘The Property Guide to Humanity’ is a song about humility and integrity. Whether you live in an urban slum  or a palatial home you can still lead a honest life. Life is not all about owning things!
‘Horse on Fire’ is possible my favourite WGF song. I read a magazine  article about a guy who’s daughter was abducted in Iran(?). The song is full of anger and self reproach. I think the loss of a son or daughter and not knowing where they are, must be an unbearable burden to carry. Anger is the key to this song.

++ Where did the songwriting inspiration come for you guys?

Karl: I have to start with LB here, who were a post-punk band who were profoundly influenced by the music around them…New Order, James, Julian Cope, Siouxsie and the Banshees, The Cure…However, all that stopped with WGF.
I can honestly say that all I/we listened to was WGF. I sold all my records, except for a few Nick Cave and Microdisney albums, I enjoyed our music to the exclusion of all others. But I would say at that point I was more into books…James Joyce (see Postcard), Virginia Woolf, Martin Amis, Will Self, Graham Swift, Ian McEwan, Keats, Auden…too, too, many to mention!

Carl: For me when in LB it was early punk and some of those Karl mentions above..but when we formed  WGF like Karl says above it became the be all and end all and other bands music was of very little influence/importance to us.

++ Also I’m wondering, as you only had one release, and it seems you have a bunch of unreleased tunes, three quick questions: how many songs you recorded? how many demo tapes were there? and will there be any sort of retrospective compilation?

Karl: LB recorded 2 demos containing a total of 7 songs WGF recorded 4 demos containing 12 songs plus a session for the single in which ‘Postcard’ was re-recorded and a a song called ‘Big Night Noise’ which appeared on the single release.
A retrospective compilation has been mentioned on a number of occasions tho that’s a far as it has got so far… I think that we would do it if it was going to be done properly giving the songs a chance to reach a wide audience.

++ I’ve been having a hard time finding this record! From what I’ve listened on last.fm and myspace, it’s really fantastic! No wonder it’s so sought after! How many copies were pressed and how was it received by the music press?

Karl: There were a 1000 copies pressed (Some of which are in my attic!!!) the music press were indifferent as at the time the whole Madchester thing was starting to happen so there wasnt much interest to be honest but we did have a few major record/publishing companies sniffing around but it all came to nothing in the end.

++ The Birmingham scene from the late 80s seems to have been vibrant with some favourite bands of mine like Mighty Mighty, The Sea Urchins, or The Cudgels. How did you enjoy the city back then? What were your favourite venues?

Karl: Yes I remember these bands and others…. we only knew the Cudgels who were based near to ourselves and were very good at what they did..Birmingham itself was a very different city then but we loved it and the few venues that would let us play ..especially ‘Synatras’ where we became good friends with the DJ/Promoter Tony Reynolds who went on to help us quite a bit.

++ Did you gig a lot? Any particular gigs you remember?

Karl: We didn’t gig prolifically but tended to play college shows out of town good ones I can remember are ..Gloucester College of Art & Tech, Luton College of HE, Cheltenham College of St Paul & St Mary..Bath University, University of London Union..the electric brrom cupboard in Sherbourne Somerset

++ What was the highlight of being in Where Gardens Fall?

Karl: Really just seeing these songs being transformed from just acoustic guitar & vocals to being full blown band songs going down well at gigs and being released… and people who didn’t owe us a thing i.e. people we didnt know appreciating them.

++ If I was visiting Birmingham as a tourist, which places would you recommend me to visit? Maybe some of your favourite spots?

Karl: Birmingham today is so different to way back then and is really tourist friendly. a lot of the old band haunts we knew have gone…. maybe in band terms a place like JB’s in the nearby town of Dudley as that is still a place dedicated to live music without ever having  being sanitised by ‘progress’.

++ And what about your favourite balti house?

Karl: Really cant comment too much on this, as far from an expert on such matters more than to say I did spend many an evening in ‘Imrans’ on the Ladypool Rd in the Sparkbrook area of Birmingham.(B’hams balti mile)

++ When and why did you decide to split? Were you involved with bands after?

Karl: We split in April 1990 after a gig in Tamworth in Staffordshire….personnel probs really which should not have been a prob at all considering the way we wrote but we felt we needed a break from it and just never returned to take it further.
No there were no bands after this for either of us.

++ Thanks again so much! Anything else you’d like to add?

Karl: Just one again thank you for the interest that you have shown in LB & WGF and that over the 2 bands we had some great times and hopefully produced a few songs that people enjoyed.

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Listen
Where Gardens Fall – Search

Thanks so much to Nikki and Marty for the great interview! This was a dream interview as I absolutely LOVE the Splashdown EP! And on top of that, “The 18:10 To Yeovil Junction” is one of my favourite songs EVER. I’m terribly happy to publish this in the blog, hope you enjoy! You can always befriend the band on myspace too

++ Hi Nikki! Hi Marty! I’m so honoured to get the chance to interview you. Bubblegum Splash! symbolizes what indie pop was all about. One perfect 7″ and then the band splits. Do you agree with me on this?

Nikki: Hi Roque I am amazed and touched that after all this time and like you say, one 7”, that anyone (apart from friends and family) remembers Bubblegum Splash! Do I agree with you -yes and no!  Love the Pastels and they have released loads also BMX Bandits etc.

Marty: Yes and no plus the whole B.S thing was not premeditated.

++ So how did you all meet? How did the band start? Have any of you been involved in other bands before? Or maybe at the same time?

Nikki: Jim, Marty, Dave and Alan were all at school together and had written a fanzine so they were all friends. I was in the Star pub in Salisbury one night wearing a Jesus and Mary Chain t-shirt, Jim was impressed by the t-shirt so came up to me and asked if I wanted to be the singer in their band. As I was drunk I said yes. Had I been sober or wearing a different T-shirt……………..!?

No other bands before .Jim and Dave were in Jane From Occupied Europe after.

++ Why the name Bubblegum Splash?

Marty: Random names put together that didn’t mean anything. We didn’t want to be called “the” something or other……

++ You only released 7 songs in total, but did you have more songs? Maybe they are tapes or so?

Marty and Nikki: Yeah there were more on demo and some we did live that not sure were ever recorded. Honeycomb centre was a favourite and our 6 min wigout. We also did a few covers live Swell maps: H.S Art and The Undertones: True Confessions.

++ How did you end up releasing the split flexi (with The Darling Buds) on the So Naive fanzine?

Nikki: I can’t remember how that came about and Marty is laughing and has just informed me that it was because Mike Brunt who wrote the fanzine fancied me. HA! HA! First I’ve heard of it , not sure how true that is.

++ The name of the zine was taken from a Rosehips song… did you like them? What about this, The Darling Buds or The Primitives?

Nikki: Yeah we really liked the Rosehips did a gig with them in Stoke, stayed at Ants house after if I remember rightly,  slept on the dining room floor.

Primitives or Darling Buds? Hard one, cus of flexi and gigs with Darling Buds. Plus bad experience at a Primitives gig in London- vomiting in plastic bags all night as ill.

++ How did the contact from the Subway Organisation happen? How was the relationship with them?

Marty: Martin Whitehead phoned us up-after we had sent them a demo. Good people not really a business relationship.

++ When you got to know the Splashdown EP went to number 15 of the indie charts, what was your reaction?

Marty: I looked in the N.M.E and saw our name, first reaction was disbelief, then amazed and proud.

Nikki: I was amazed. Think I laughed and jumped around the kitchen where I was living at the time. (I didn’t know heard it about third hand after finishing work.)

++ Stephen Pastel once said: ““But on the minus there are groups like Bubblegum Splash! we played with them in Bristol, and they just summed up everything that was wrong in music just now. I mean they had one song that went la-la-la like Primal Scream and another with the bum-de-bum drumbeats a la Shop Assistants. It was just a joke.” What would you answer him?! Why do you think he said so?

Nikki: He has a point. I joined the band knowing I couldn’t really sing, it was good fun, never thought we would gig let alone release anything. I was very shy and nervous. In band practices I used to sing behind a curtain.

Marty: We were all nervous as buggery –not a joke.

++ What’s the story behind “The 18:10 to Yeovil Junction”? It’s such a beautiful song! And why did it was included twice on the Subway compilations?

Nikki: 18.10 is my favourite B.S track it is a lovely tune. Jim wrote it as he did all our songs.

Marty: It’s about “Love, longing and solitary train journeys”. It’s on two because it’s fab.

++ How do you remember the Bubblegum Splash recording sessions? Any anecdotes you could share? How was the creative process for you all?

Nikki: I remember recording sessions as being good fun, a laugh. I probably used to get over excited. Jim was the boss, wrote everything and had to help us all, so was probably stressful for him. We used to drink a hell of a lot of chocolate milk. Band practices were a hoot, we had to get our stuff to the rehearsal room (Britford Village Hall) in a wheelbarrow. Punk Rock!

Marty: I remember recording sessions as frustrating. Splashdown ep was recorded the day Andy Warhol died- led to our 15 mins of fame!

++ What about gigs? Any gigs you remember the most? What were your favourite?

Nikki: My favourite gig was the one with the Pastels, Tallulah Gosh and the Vaselines in Bristol (even though Stephen hated us). It was so exciting playing a gig with bands we loved and admired. Loads of our friends came from Salisbury to see us. FUN! FUN! FUN! Although I also have fond memories of the Tropic Club in Bristol too with the Darling Buds and Flatmates.

Worst one was the one in Stoke the sound was crap ,Alan the drummer stormed off stage through the drum kit then later on me and Alan had a fight, we didn’t like each other very much. I think it actually ended up being our last ever gig.

Marty: Alan crashed the car on the way back from Stoke.

++ Why and when did you call it a day?

Marty: Shortly after the Stoke gig- 13 months as a band 13 gigs and probably 13 songs!

++ Looking back, what was the best moment of being part of the band?

Nikki: I had a great time despite being very shy and nervous. I did quite often sing with my back towards the audience holding my lyrics as I was so scared, also had to have Jim nod me in as I would freeze. Travelling to and from gigs was a riot a great laugh. Obviously hearing us on John Peel was amazing.

Marty: Best moment for me was hearing us being played on John Peel on the car radio  on way back from band practice.

++ Do you follow any indiepop bands now? If so, which ones you like?

Marty: Not really although I still have a soft spot for Scottish bands. At the moment I like Frightened Rabbit and We Were Promised Jetpacks.

Nikki: I still like all the old stuff but I really like The Pains Of Being Pure At Heart.

++ Do you mind some random questions? I was wondering, what secret skills does Nikki Barr has? What’s your favourite dish? who was the coolest personality in those C86 days?

Nikki Barr has no skills secret or not, apart from I am known as the Queen of Burps/Belching in my house!!

Marty and Nikki: Favourite dish: Mussels

Marty: Coolest personality: Harvey from the Darling Buds and Debbie Flatmate.

Nikki: Aggi Pastel.

Nikki: ME.  HA! HA!HA!

++ Thanks again for the interview! Anything else you’d like to add?

Thanks hope this has been helpful xxxxx

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Listen
Bubblegum Splash – The 18:10 To Yeovil Junction

Thanks so much to Andy Milton and Jon Fagg for the interview! Please be sure to get the new retrospective album “Hellish Mad Rush” from Firestation Records, I really recommend it! And also be friends with The Ogdens in their myspace!

++ There was an early incarnation of the Ogdens with Vince in singing duties. What happened to him? What was the name of the band? Was it easy to continue after?

Jon: Pretty soon, Vince decided that he didn’t want to sing in that band, so he concentrated on playing guitar and I played bass. We started looking around for a singer and were lucky enough to find John, who I thought was great the very first time I heard him sing. At this stage we didn’t have a name for the band.

Vince then got married. His wife was American and they went off to live in the States (where Vince is now something big in the financial world). The only time we ever played live with that line-up (which also featured Karen on trumpet) was at Vince’s leaving party. We played Leaving on a Jet Plane for him, among other things.

Because we knew that Vince was leaving and that I was going to take over guitar playing duties, we had already recruited Jay D as bassist. He was in the audience at that first gig.

It was never in doubt that we would continue.

Andy: No doubt at all. We moved to London to form a band, and so it was just a case of managing the transition from one line up to another. Saying that, it was an uncertain point, as only Jon knew JD. We needn’t have worried, having an experienced bass player tightened the whole thing and allowed us to explore what the Ogdens could be.

++ How did you all knew each other? Where had you met?

Jon: Andy, Vince and I were students in Coventry (Andy: near Leamington Spa) together. John was a friend of my girlfriend at the time. Karen was my cousin and Jay D worked with me.

Andy: Jon and I had played together in three bands before the Ogdens. Jon had heard me practising drums in my room one day and came to ask me to join the first band. He’d had his reservations after being told that all the people in the house were hippies. I wasn’t, so we played together then on and off for twenty years.

++ Where does the name The Ogdens come from? Why didn’t the name Fuck Puffin get chosen?

Jon: Jay D suggested the name. It comes from the name of a family in the British soap opera, Coronation Street. I seem to recall that we all liked the idea straight away.

We had considered the name The Fuck Puffins and liked it. However, we didn’t think we’d get played on the radio much with a name like that, or else they would shorten the name to The Puffins. The Fuck Puffins sounds great; The Puffins sounds rubbish, so we decided against it.

Andy: I don’t know how much difference it would have made had we chosen The Fuck Puffins. We faced a lot of stick over choosing “The Ogdens” but if you’ve ever had to choose a band name you’d know the relief when you finally find one that everybody is happy with. I suggested “Vegetable Terrorists” but it didn’t find any support, which in hindsight was probably a good thing.

++ You release three fantastic singles, all of them getting fantastic reviews on the press, but which one is your favourite among them all and why?

Jon: I’m glad you liked them! My favourite, as a song, is Rachel Put Your Arms About Me. The one I think sounds the best is She Made Everything Groovy and it was the most enjoyable to record too. I don’t like It’s A Beautiful Day at all and was not very keen on the idea of it being our first single, even at the time.

Andy: Groovy was the best for me as well. It was a great experience working with the producer Overend Watts from Mott the Hoople. We put everything into it, financially and physically, and I loved the song. Had we done a fourth single, for me it should have been I Want to Know Everything as I think that’s even better.

++ Why did you decide go the “self-release” way? Was it easy to set up the Casca label? Did you ever consider releasing anyone else other than The Ogdens?

Jon: If anyone had offered to release the singles for us we would have been delighted. They didn’t, so we did it ourselves. It did have the unintended consequence of giving us complete artistic control, though.

I don’t recall there being too much involved in setting up the label, but I might have that wrong.

We nearly bankrupted ourselves making She Made Everything Groovy. The idea of spending our money on releasing other people’s records would have been unimaginable at the time.

Andy: There isn’t too much involved in setting up a label apart from handling the registration with the bodies that collect the royalties and the packaging of records and posting them to radio stations. So there was some effort but it was just an extension of what you do as a small band to promote yourselves anyway. We did a postering campaign in parts of London, going out with a bucket of paste, posters and a brush late at night. We almost got caught sometimes and it could be freezing, with paste congealing up your right arm it was not what you could describe as fun. We usually ended the evening in the pub which made up for it.

++ Talking about others… who were your favourite bands back then? Would you see Ogdens members at different gigs in London enjoying their favourite bands? What were your favourite venues in town?

Jon: Some of my favourites would have been The House of Love, Ride (who we played with in Aldershot), My Bloody Valentine, The Corn Dollies (who we also played with). There were some bands who were friends of ours too: No Corridor (who are reforming to play at Andy’s 50th birthday party), The Baby Boys and The Onan Brothers.

John and I used to go out to a lot of gigs together; checking out venues, checking out bands, trying to meet all the right people. Some of my favourite venues would have been Dingwalls, Drummonds in Euston, The Bull and Gate. I liked The Jericho Tavern in Oxford too. The Town and Country Club was probably my favourite of the bigger venues.

Andy: One of our friends Andrew Cunningham used to run a club, God’s Little Joke, he’s an amazing songwriter and I loved some of the acoustic acts that used to play at the club. Many never made any records but it was the closest thing to a “scene” I’ve ever been involved with.

++ Right now you’ve just released a fantastic retrospective compilation called “Hellish Mad Rush” that everyone that loves guitar pop should definitely get it! How did this release came up to life? And what can someone that has never heard the Ogdens before expect?

Jon: I’ll leave Andy to tell the story of how the album came about, since it was largely down to him.

If you’ve never heard The Ogdens before: prepare for a Hellish Mad Rush!

In reality, of course, this is not the album we would have made had we ever been in a position to make one. These songs cover a period of four or more years. It’s really nice that the singles are available for people this way though. It will stop people selling them on eBay for ridiculous prices!

Andy: It’s very odd really, as although it might have happened anyway at some point because we were on Firestation Records’ hit list, the reason it’s happened now was because Jon was looking at MySpace and came across another band with the same name. I was outraged, I set up our own page and emailed them saying we had the name first. In the end they were very good about it and changed their name but within two weeks of our page going up Firestation had contacted us about appearing on The Sound of Leamington Spa No.8 and it just went from there. BTW we will be on The Sound of Leamington Spa No.8 with another version of Patricia.

++ How do you remember your last gig at The Plough? Were there any tears?

Jon: No tears. We didn’t know at the time that it would certainly be the last gig, although I think we were pretty sure. Our final gigs were some of the best we ever did, but John wanted to move on and it wouldn’t have been The Ogdens without him.

Andy: I remember we played really well and had a great time, packed the place out, and made a profit. The review was pretty good as well.

++ Is it too much to ask what’s the story behind the Rachel from “Rachel Put Your Arms About Me? It’s such a beautiful song… I have to ask this question!

Jon: The idea for the song came from an interview I read with Guy Chadwick, from The House Of Love. He said that he wanted to write a song simply called I Love You, which put the lyrical idea in my head. The idea for the coda was also taken from a House Of Love song (I forget which one just at the moment).

I used to share a flat with a guy called Robin. One day I answered the phone and it was a girl asking for him. I asked her name and she said, “It’s Rachel, Rachel Jones,” (maybe it wasn’t Jones, but you get the idea). That’s where Rachel Rachel came from.

It’s a song about male neediness and how us men look for women to be everything; sister, mother, lover. That and the reassurance and comfort that can come from being enfolded in someone’s arms. Oh yes, and the male ability to screw everything up by going off with someone else. I was really good at that in those days, I’m sorry to say. The ensuing torment gave me lots of ideas for songs, though. I’m much more contented these days, which is why I now play in an instrumental band: I have nothing left to say.

Andy: You seem to be doing alright tonight.

++ You also made a video for this song! Tell me a bit about it!

Jon: To be honest, I don’t think the video is all that great, although it was fun to do and I did get to smash up a guitar, which I’d wanted to do since I saw John Perry of The Only Ones do it at a gig at Bristol University in 1979. Some guys we met offered to make the video for nothing, as a favour. Of course, we agreed.

Andy: It was great to do and seeing the guys put it together in their spare time and given the facilities available I think it’s fine. It does show though how much work it takes to make a truly great video.

++ What about “The Prettiest Girl in Carmathenshire”? Was it Miss Carmathenshire? What’s the connection with that county in Wales if you were a London based band?

Jon: We were based in London, but Andy and I were from Bristol originally, Jay D was from Northern Ireland and John was from Wales. The Prettiest Girl in Carmarthenshire is a reference to a poem by Welsh poet Dylan Thomas, I believe.

++ I really think you penned so many magical songs, from “Yeah Yeah Yeah” to “She Made Everything Groovy”! how did you come up with all of these songs? with the melodies? with the lyrics? Why do you think you never made it bigger?

Jon: All four of us wrote songs. We’d work on them together and they were equally credited, but they always originated as one person’s idea. If you knew the four members of the band well enough, you’d be able to tell who wrote which songs. Where did they come from? The heart.

While some people in the music press were quite supportive of The Ogdens, others seemed to take against us. Maybe they didn’t like the name. I guess that It’s A Beautiful Day would have put some people off as well, since it creates the impression of a band really very different from the band we actually were.

It’s nice to finally be getting some of the recognition which we obviously felt we deserved at the time; even if we have had to wait twenty years for it!

Andy: Most of my songs came from walking down the street. Some came in one lump but others in bits and pieces. I had a beaten up old car which took us to gigs and became part of The Ogdens’ mythology. A girlfriend gave me a rose which I placed on the dashboard where it dried and was preserved. It was a nice contrast to the fierce look of the vehicle and on a journey to a gig someone came up with the line “There’s a dead rose on the dashboard” sung in a country style. From then on several of us had a go at incorporating it into a song. It eventually became part of Boeing Boeing Bomb! a comic song about terrorism.

++ After splitting up, you formed a band called Sunburst. I’ve never heard anything about it! Did you release anything? Was it in the same vein of The Ogdens? What’s the story behind it?

Jon: Not many people have heard about Sunburst, which is actually a bit of a shame, because we were a great band. After John decided to leave The Ogdens, we got in a mate of Jay D’s as a vocalist. Gatt was a really brilliant singer and we went off in a much rockier direction (although, to be honest, The Ogdens were headed in a similar direction towards the end). We never released anything, but there is a whole album’s worth of pretty decent demos. We also recorded a version of America’s A Horse With No Name with the intention of maybe releasing it as a single. Unfortunately, this never actually happened. You should hear it, though, it’s truly epic.

Andy: We were great but unlike The Ogdens I think we lacked the belief that we would conquer the world.

++ What are some other favourite hobbies of yours aside from playing music?

Jon: I like football. I support Bristol Rovers, which is pretty sad really.

Andy: Even though I support Bristol City (we come from opposite sides of the city) I don’t think it’s sad. Football is about having a connection with a team. I know people who support Chelsea or Manchester United and have never seen them live. They’ve only chosen them because the teams are successful and have shirts the right colour or they fancy a particular player. That’s sad. You’ll be with Rovers in better times Jon.

++ Anything else you’d like to say to Ogdens fans out there?

Jon: It’s been truly humbling to discover that, even after all these years, there are people who still really care about the Ogdens’ music. So thanks. I only wish we’d known about you all at the time.

Andy: I echo Jon’s words. Thanks for the support. It’s the audience that makes it happen.

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Listen
The Ogdens – Rachel Put Your Hands About Me

Thanks so much to Phil Suggars for another fantastic interview! Before being in CC Baxter Phil was in The Candie Maids and we already talked extensively about it many months ago. On the next Cloudberry fanzine CD compilation the song Camden Lockout will be included so don’t miss it! Oh! and here’s one and another pic from the band!

++ After The Candie Maids you became the Archangels and then CC Baxter. So tell me what happened in between the bands? Were there major lineup changes? Why the change of names?

I think Warren (bass) and I had the idea that we wanted to change names each time personnel changed or we took a different tack musically. The Candie Maids were Warren, Vicki (guitar, keyboards and b-vox) and myself (guitar and drums) and a drum machine. I don’t think we were every really happy with the name ‘cos it was achingly twee. Musically we started to get into sequencing things and when Dom (drums) and Hayley from the Doris Days got involved and we settled on the name Archangels which if anything was a bit too much the other way. A friend of mine said it made us sound like a hair-metal outfit.

++ Were does the name CC Baxter comes from?

After we’d played a few gigs in London our manager told us that there was a US band called Archangels who were threatening to sue us so we thought “fair enough it’s a crap name anyway” and changed ours to CC Baxter which comes from the character Jack Lemmon plays in Billy Wilder’s “The Apartment”.

++ Was it any different composing songs now compared to the Candie Maids? How did the CC Baxter songs shape up? Did you practice often?

With the Candie Maids we’d just play together till something sprouted out of the mess. The main difference with CCBaxter was that because we’d moved to a more sequenced/sampled sound (and back then we didn’t use a computer just a shed load of metal with flashing lights and buttons on it) the composition process was this:

1. I’d get the rough basis for a song down in the equipment. Hayley would embellish stuff at this stage because she actually knew the difference between the black notes and the white ones. Often we’d have a rough bass and drum track on the song just for writing purposes.
2. We’d drag all the kit down to our weekly rehearsal, wire it all together and stare at the flashing LEDs for a bit and then play around with the basic structure to see what we came up with. Usually, we’d switch the sampled drums and bass off so Warren and Dom could write something original and make things a bit more ‘live’.

++ So where did you practice? How was a usual CC Baxter practice? Was there lots of alcohol? Perhaps a couple of pizzas? For sure it was lots of fun, right?

Yes, it was loads of fun. We used to rehearse every Saturday at a place called Bloomsbury studios which I think is now called Mockin’ Bird. It was run by a guy called Terry Popple who used to drum for Van Morrison. Terry was nice fellow though he always jokingly referred to us as “The Fab Hunk” trio since we all young and a bit slight of frame. Generally speaking we didn’t get too drunk, but there was always a break for a beer and (veggie) burger halfway through. Being a drummer Dom always favoured a kebab.

++ On the 1993 demo you worked with Tim Freeman from Frazier Chorus! How did that go? How did you meet and what did he bring into the studio? Any anecdotes you can share?

I met Tim through Adrian Sherwood’s manager Bobby Marshall who used to manage an indie-dance outfit called Eusebio (who Warren played bass for). We sort of talked Bobby into managing us though in reality he wasn’t that enthusiastic and was just too nice to tell us f*ck off. In any case he suggested that Tim work with us. At the time Tim was writing material for a publishing deal and so he’d come over to our place and we’d swap material and then he’d help out with our arrangements. I’d seen him on TV performing “Cloud 8″ so when he came round I remember thinking “bloody hell! This bloke is a proper pop-star and he’s in our house drinking tea!”

++ Was this demo the only recordings by CC Baxter? Why didn’t such great songs get properly released?

Thanks, I’m glad you liked the songs. Yes, this was the only demo that we did as CC Baxter. As to why they didn’t get picked up, it’s hard to say. Live we were always a bit of shambles and working with hardware sequencers and samplers that weren’t reliable was sometimes a sphincter clenching experience.

A couple of labels told us we needed to go away and “practice more”, but I wonder how much of that was to do with the fact that we were quite “anti-rock”. In any case one thing that definitely didn’t help us was that we didn’t have strong management. When the demo came out we were doing it all ourselves which unless you know a few people I wouldn’t recommend.

++ One of the songs is called “Ry Cooder”? Was him a big influence on you? why did you dedicate a song to him?

He’s a brilliant musician and he wrote the soundtrack for Paris-Texas which is some of my favourite film music. The reason for the homage in the title is (don’t tell your lawyer) that there’s a sample of that soundtrack in the instrumental break and the outro as well as some of the dialogue from the film in the song.

++ Through my not so great research skills I found out about The Lockout: “… is a monthly music event held in Camden, which prides itself on showcasing the best new musical talent the UK music scene has to offer.” Is this what the song “Camden’s Lockout” is about? Did you participate or something?

Now that’s just weird. I had no idea there was anything called the Camden Lockout. I thought I’d just come up with the title after we’d been recording a demo at Falconer studios in London. Maybe I saw a poster for the event while we were up there and it seeped into my tiny brain.

++ And the other song I know by you is “Flake Girl a Go-Go” which I guess it’s about the Cadbury Flake Girl? Are you a big fan of chocolate? What are your favourite ones? And what about the flake girl, do you have a favourite? :p

You’re correct it is about the women in Cadbury’s Flake adverts. And yes I do like chocolate and Flake’s in particular ;). At the time we wrote this there were a whole series of Cadbury’s Flake advertisements that were sexualized in really over the top way and the song just uses them as a throwaway example of the silly media images of the perfect woman. (More importantly I just liked coming up with daft song titles to see if I could make our drummer, Dom, laugh).

++ The change from The Candie Maids to CC Baxter is almost one of 180 degrees! What were you listening at this time? Why did you went for a more synth driven band than a guitar band as before?

I think we were just excited by the sonic possibilities of early samplers. We actually never had a synthesizer as such, all the electronic side of things was sample based. I just loved the idea of lifting sounds off of records and then mangling them up to own them.

At the time we were listening to stuff like the Beloved, New Order, Wire, Wolfgang Press, Paul Haig, Weekend, Section 25, the Pale Fountains, quite a lot of early house stuff. Oh, and Kylie Minogue back when it wasn’t okay to like her. (I seem to remember writing a love note to her under her coat hook backstage when we played one of her haunts in London. Needless to say she never wrote back.)

++ Your final gig was in 1995, right? How was it? Any particular gigs you remember?

The final gig was ok, (flier attached) though I think at the time if we’d known it was our last we probably would have drunk a lot more and broken our manifesto by indulging in a few stage dives.

I do remember one horrible moment during a gig at Sussex University where the sequencer somehow became disconnected from the drum machine, but both continued playing merrily away while drifting hopelessly out of time with each other till everything ended in a completely horrible clattering mess. Luckily enough it was happy hour and so our audience were too drunk to care too much.

The flip side to that was one gig we played at the Brighton Dome where a pro engineer came in to mix us (we were pretty dense and unbalanced live). I remember we started the first song and I felt like Marty McFly at the beginning of Back to the Future. This shimmering wall of sound shook the whole venue. “Jesus!” I thought, “so that’s what we sound like on a good day.”

++ You went through the late 80s and the early 90s… music had changed a lot, especially for us pop fans. It wasn’t that common to see the bands we liked on the NME or getting many gigs. Did you notice this change? Do you think it was the natural course of things or were you pissed? Did it affect at all your bands you think?

A few of the A&R people we met seemed to be looking for the next Nirvana and I used to get frustrated with being told that we needed to put guitar solos over everything, but pop music by definition is a cultural process that’s driven by the tastes of its consumers. Things go in and out of favour all the time and that feeds renewal which seems about right to me.

On a personal note, I felt a bit outmatched when I heard Bjork’s first solo album. “Crap,” I thought, “there’s no way I could write anything as good as that.”

++ Waz moved to London and you weren’t happy with britpop so the band called it a day. It’s been a while now, are you still in touch with the band? What do the band members do nowadays?

Yes, we are all still in touch and all doing various things though we haven’t physically met up for a few years now (I was out of the country and Dom’s not in Brighton). I do think we will be having a get together soon though. If nothing else just so we can buy Dom a Donner Kebab for old time’s sake.

++ Anything else you’d like to add?

Nothing other than to thank you for your enthusiasm and for putting our track on your CD. We were laughing the other day, wishing you and your fanzine had been around when we’d recorded the demo back in 1993.

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Listen
CC Baxter – Ry Cooder

After Tim Headman told me a bit more about the Watt Government not so long ago, Steve Nash, who played acoustic guitar and vocals, was very nice to give me an interview about their band! Thanks so much to both for getting in touch and sharing all these stories! Again, please check videos from their diverse projects here!

++ Hi again! Thanks so much for doing the interview! I was very curious about your band and you got in touch, out of the blue! How are all you doing today?

Right now it’s Halloween and I have just been out with my nine year old son been really busy with my job (I work freelance in health and social care) Curtis and his friend Owen, trick or treating. This is still a fairly low key thing in the UK, compared to how I think it is in the states. I have but I am excited about the new band I am getting together called ‘Arthur 2 Stroke, WM7 and Big Black Bomb’

++ I know some of you were already playing together in Arthur 2 Stroke and the Chart Commandos before joining the Watt Government. Care telling me a bit more about this band? What is the discography of this band? And how did you all meet in the first place

In 1978 in Newcastle it seemed like everybody was in a band. As a result spending the summer acting in a Walt Disney film shot in Alnwick Castle (Where they later did Robin Hood Prince of Thieves with Kevin Costner) I got to know a few people who had started a regular scene playing in a pub every week, promoting events, and gathering like-minded souls around a concept called Anti Pop. Arthur 2 Stroke was initially the main creative force behind this scene and he also fronted one of the bands that played every week, but never with the same musicians. I liked his humour and style of music and so I approached him and we started playing together regularly, two electric guitars and a drummer, and he christened me WM7. Over the next few months the band grew – I knew Tim from college and he joined on bass initially, but moved on to guitar. The Chart Commandos had evolved into a proper seven piece backing band for Arthur by 79/80, as a result of
recruiting different people in different ways as we went along. We were influenced by Geno Washington and the Ram Jam Band, Ian Dury and the Blockheads, Dexie’s Midnight Runners, Madness and a love for TV theme tunes and Northern Soul. By this time, I had moved on to trumpet…

A2S and the CCs sort of fizzled out in 1983. We had played hundreds of gigs and had an amazing following in the North East of England BUT we never managed to match our live success with any really decent recording, and eventually we all needed to move on.

++ What happened in the time between Arthur 2 Stroke and the Chart Commandos and the Watt Government?

As I remember it when the Chart Commandos split up, we all went our separate ways for a while. Tim continued writing and recording some songs, using us lot in the studio, Pat (keyboards) rejoined Archie Brown and the Young Bucks and released a great album called ‘Bring me the head of Jerry Garcia’; Davey, Ian and Grahame and Ross (Drums and Bass and Sax and trumpet) joined our ex roadie to form a new band whose very 80s name escapes me…and Stevie our percussionist I were recruited on trumpet to another new Newcastle band called ‘The Pressgang’

This was quite a diverse but ultimately doomed outfit, with a Jamaican drummer and a Malaysian keyboard player, a brilliant but mentally troubled guy on sax, and two black British female singers, one who was an ‘exotic dancer’ in the clubs around Tyneside, and the other was Debbie – who became my girlfriend and subsequently my wife. The Pressgang had self imploded after a few short months, a year tops, when one day I took a phone call for my flatmate Andy Pop, who had been the other half of the driving force behind Anti Pop (the business side)

Andy still promoted various gigs and events in Newcastle at that time (1983/84) and on the other end of the phone was an agent who needed a ‘jazz duo’ to support Alexi Sayle at his gig in Middlesbrough in a few night’s time. I suddenly got this idea that Tim and Debbie and I could put something together so I told the agent that I knew this band, and luckily Tim and Debbie were up for it! Tim had already thought of the name Watt Government, so we threw a bizarre mix of country and western and home-made topical reggae tunes together, and went down so well were offered three more dates. We played as a three piece for a while, then as the five piece you see on the The Tube video, and then finally poached back the rest of the Chart Commandos – the rest is history!

++ You also said to me that you were influenced by a lot of African music. Was it easy to have access to it? What about UK music, was there anything you enjoyed at the time?

Now we are moving into the early 80s, and the birth of Watt Government out of the ashes of the Chart Commandos in 83/84. Here and there in Newcastle and the rest of the UK people were picking up on ‘World Music’ especially (in my case) African musicians like King Sunny Ade, Fela Kuti, Hugh Masekela, The Bhundu Boys (although perhaps they came later!). As I remember it was not so hard to access, but I guess there was nowhere near the variety and choice that is available now.

In terms of other bands, I seem to remember that we had quite lot of time for all kinds of music – we were big fans of Gil Scott Heron and Curtis Mayfield who were overtly political in their lyrics, and in the UK at the
time people like Elvis Costello, Billy Bragg, The Style Council, The Clash, (and many more I can’t remember!) were all doing political/social commentary but we were into all sorts of other things, Stax, Tamla, Talking Heads, Grace Jones, early rap like Grandmaster Flash and Run DMC, lots of reggae, contemporary and old style Trojan…and good pop music, we were all always partial to good pop music

++ What do you think about being categorized as neo-aco?

Sounds good! One of the problems we had at the time was that we played lots of different styles live and this made us hard to categorise, so it’s interesting to finally be located in a genre – albeit on the basis of one
single!

++ From what you told me, your songs were quite political. But how involved were you in politics?

Tim and I were working in the ‘public sector’ health and education respectively, and all of us were very aware of the way Margaret Thatcher’s policies (she was the prime minister of quite a right wing government) were
adversely affecting the most vulnerable people in our society at that time. In the North East the miner’s strike was very significant, due to the importance of coal mining to the history and economy and culture of the area, and there was a lot of anger and hardship about the decimation of the coal industry by Thatcher’s government. We played a number of benefit gigs, and some people in the band knew activists and people who were undergoing real hardship, but at a personal level I have never really been much of a political activist. To me, Tim and Davey (the drummer) always seemed much better informed and aware. Tim tended to write most of the words and most of the time they were about the things in the news, and the way government decisions and actions affected ordinary people

++ How do you feel about Gordon Brown then?

Hey now Roque, far too many column inches have been spent on this subject already. I guess I see him as a nearly man, I don’t think he is particularly a bad prime minister, but having to follow Tony Blair, who was much more charismatic, and then being hit by the global recession, and domestic twaddle like expenses scandals, meant that he never really stood much of a chance. I also think these things go in cycles, and the same party that was welcomed into office by dancing in the streets 10 years ago has now become tired and ineffective and full of infighting. What depresses me most is that the whole game has shifted to the right in this country, the amount of people we lock up, the way we treat asylum seekers, the pressure on single mums and other ‘unemployed’ groups, negative images of young people, it’s all a very depressing if you let it get to you

++ What are your memories of recording the single? Any anecdotes you could share?

We seemed to record so many versions of it! In fact there were only two proper gos at it – the one with the Kane Gang, which I still have somewhere, and then the one we did ourselves when that got lost – Tim has told you about this already. The Kane Gang experience was very interesting to me because it was the one time we actually worked with producers. Mostly we just depended on the engineer and our own judgement. One thing I do remember is that one time we went into the studio (called Lynx, it’s just been demolished to make way for a ’student village’) and Hugh Masekela was in there finishing off recording a session for the Tube. I was in awe, and wanted to speak to him but came over all clumsy. The amazing thing was he
just said hello and set about moving his stuff so that we could sit down. He was so humble warm and friendly. But I still didn’t know what to say to the man!

++ Why didn’t Kitchenware want to release the single anymore? Ok, the master tapes were stolen, but that’s not a good reason at all, especially for such a nice single! How come Volume Records came to rescue you and release the 7″?

I guess it all comes down to money in the end – there was only so much money they were prepared to invest, and when that was spent, that was it. Also I don’t think they were really committed to the idea that we could be successful. I can’t remember how Volume got involved, but Tim can tell you more about that, he was always the mover and the shaker!

++ What happened to the song “Watt Government”? Why didn’t it get released as a single as you expected?

Technically it was never did get very far as a single. We all loved the song (and I still do, I do an acoustic version with some friends of mine currently, although we have yet to perform it publicly). As I recall, we got
some studio time booked up one time after Tim had left and gone to Vancouver, we timed this to coincide with when he was back in the UK on a visit. Maybe 87 or 88? It was never properly mixed or finished off, and the band had split by then so there was no real focus to do anything with it. These days it’s all a bit easier I think – I mean it doesn’t matter if you don’t have a band as such, but in those days the the band was the thing. The version that exists has a certain magic though, and I can send it to you sometime to see what you think if you like

++ You also appeared in a couple of TV shows doing live performances. How was that experience? Is it much different than playing live at a club? How did you get into the TV shows by the way? Today guitar pop bands don’t get invited that often to TV shows!

TV was always fascinating – everything gets focused on a few minutes performance, and it can be much more intense and difficult than playing a whole set for an hour or more, when you can work with the crowd and build up some excitement. It’s a bit like recording in that I think it requires its own set of skills and just because you can play in a band and write good songs doesn’t mean you can come over well on tv. I can’t comment on what it’s like for bands these days

++ How was the scene in Newcastle back then? Any good bands from the time that deserve to be remembered?

Crikey that’s a hard one. Like I said above, there were loads of bands, but to be honest I can’t remember too many of them now. Some friends of ours were in The Hostages, and they did ok for a while, got a deal and released a single ‘Pretend you’re American’ but it didn’t go far. Maybe Tim can remember some of the others….

++ What about gigs? Did you gig a lot? Any in particular that you remember fondly?

Gigs were always hard work – often we had to promote them ourselves and do all of the organising. Personally my favourite was our second gig at The Crucible in Sheffield. We were supporting Alexi Sayle who was at that time a stand up comedian, one of the then new breed of ‘alternative’ comics. At that point it was me and Tim on guitar and backing vocals and Debbie singing. We were in danger of becoming a musical comedy act perhaps but I quite liked it and we went down very well with the crowd that had come to see Alexi Sayle. We had worked out a whole little routine in no time at all and it felt edgy and fresh. That would be a personal favourite!

++ When and why did the Watt Government called it a day? Were you all involved with music after?

Now then, I think I am going to have to cite the usual ‘musical differences’ here. There was some personal relationship stuff in the band but mainly my take on it would be that Tim had worked very hard to try and make something happen with Working My Fingers and when that didn’t happen he wanted to withdraw and reflect for a while. Then he decided to move to Canada and I didn’t have anyone else to write songs with!

Tim went on to do a lot of music in Vancouver, which he can tell you about. Ian our bass player went to California to work with Sid Griffin and the Coal Porters. Stevie our percussionist has never stopped playing the working men’s clubs in the North East. For a few years I didn’t do much at all but now I am musician for a theatre company, I play in a community band of horns and steel pans that gigs in Newcastle, and I have just started to get a new band together with Arthur 2 Stroke which is huge fun

++ Why do you think the Watt Government didn’t get more popular? What was for you the highlight of the band?

Hard to say. I think success as a band is partly about luck but also partly about simply sticking with it, year after year, and we didn’t really have either of these things. Plus there was probably too many of us, and inevitably different people want different things. And then important things like children came along!

++ Are you still all in touch? What are the Watt Government members doing nowadays?

I still see Ian (bass) and Graham (sax) and Davey (drums) from time to time as we all still live in the area. Debbie is the mother of my children and so we are still very connected even though we split up amicably two years ago. Tim is in Vancouver but email and the occasional trip home mean that he never feels too far away really. Sort of fallen out of contact with Ross (Trumpet) and Stevie (percussion)

As far as I know we are all working but not so much involved with music these days. Just proper grown up jobs to pay the bills! I do play for Archie Brown and the Young Bucks (they are on You Tube), along with Ian and Grahame every Christmas, and Davey is the manager of the music venue at Newcastle University, but Tim has probably tried hardest to keep connected with the spirit of rock and roll…or should I say neo acoustic?

++ Thanks so much! anything you’d like to add?

No, I think I have gone on long enough, I just hope there is something here that is of interest to you. I am confident that Tim will have stuff to add, especially now I have prompted him!

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Listen
Watt Government – Working My Fingers to the Bone

I got the chance to talk again with Carl Green, the mastermind behind The Whirlpool Guest House, about The Close-Ups, a short lived but fantastic cartoon band that came to life out of his imagination. And for those wondering, you can still get the CD album here. Thanks again Carl for the great interview!

++ Hi again Carl! What have you been doing since our last interview?!

Travelling mainly, to places beginning with V- Vienna and Vegas! I tried to find culture in Vegas and strippers in Vienna. I wasn’t especially successful on either count.

++ I guess the idea of a cartoon band comes after what you were doing on the “live” gigs with The Whirlpool Guest House, but in between there was Shandy Wildtyme, so how come you decided going back to this format?

I’d always wanted to do it on a grander scale, but I was pretty broke in the 80’s. Everything was done on the cheap with Whirlpool Guest House, which was great fun but at the same time frustrating. With The Close-Ups I’d enough resources to do things on a different level, and the time seemed right to try and fulfill a long held dream of mine- namely, create my own fully animated cartoon band. Gorillaz were doing the business back then too, and I thought they could use a little competition!

++ Did you create the characters and all? Did each one had some special trait or personality?

I created the concept, look and individual personalities for the four band members, but I didn’t do the artwork. Can’t really draw! That was done by a brilliant artist from Manchester called Jez Hall. I outlined what I wanted and then “auditioned” his creations. Abby and Rake were taken on straight away, whereas the original Zack and Newt were sent back to the drawing board a couple of times!

++ One of the characters is called Newton Aycliffe, is this place important to you?

How on earth do you know about Newton Aycliffe?! It’s a wholly unremarkable new town about 15 miles from where I live and is barely known locally, let alone in Miami! Anyway, I chose the name to reflect the band’s North East roots, and hopefully get a few wry smiles.

++ Was it for The Close-Ups that you created the Northern Round Square Records label? Was it easy to set it up and distribute your releases? How was this experience?

Yeah, totally for The Close-Ups. It’s a low key affair really, with distribution via the internet and key record shops in the UK like Rough Trade, Piccadilly and Norman. I enjoy running it, but it’s the quickest way I know to lose lots of money. And friends. Still, it’s worth it when people get in touch to say how happy they are with the records and stuff- that’s the real and best reason for doing it. I’ve just re-activated it recently for our next release, the debut album by Head Of Light Entertainment.

++ So how did this band starts? How did you know Abby Connor? What is she doing nowadays?

I needed a certain voice to make the whole concept come alive- an understated vocal style with a girl-next-door vibe, with no affectations or guile. Abby was the 15 year old daughter of one of our friends, and although reluctant at first, she really got into character and lent an innocence and sense of wonder to the project it really needed. I love her voice! We named Abby Kirkella (the cartoon lead singer) after the real Abby- blurring the lines and all that nonsense!
Abby Connor is now 21 and studying art at University. A couple of bands have approached her, but she’s not really on that path anymore- painting and design is her real passion.

++ How did the recordings for what was mainly a duo happen? Was it an easy thing to do? I notice you also had many friends helping you.

The music was put together over a three year period (2002-2005), starting with the first single “I’m On My Way” in 2004, through to the album “2am In Flat 3b” released in summer 2006. I recorded the guitar and bass parts, did a guide vocal, then brought in some friends Paul and Adam to play the drums and keyboards respectively. Abby did her vocal at the end, once the full track was in place.

++ The sound of The Close-Ups is very different to your previous projects, this is not really C-86 stuff but closer to bubblegum pop. Was it because of what you were listening at the time? Or maybe you wanted to try something new?

To me it’s all just pop. Different strands but definitely still pop. It has got an intentional bubblegum skin but it’s an indie-pop heart that beats underneath. It’s still rough and sweet and skewed. The idea was to try and create an indie-pop Archies for the internet generation and I like to think we got pretty close.

++ Three vinyl singles and 1 album in around 2 years. That is quite prolific! But what is your favourite format? the Cd or the 7″ single? and why?

I love the pop aspect of the classic 7″ single- it has a magical mythical quality that CD’s just don’t have. Having said that, I do like clarity and convenience, so I suppose my CD’s do have a vital role to fulfill!

++ Why did you dedicate a song to Jean Shrimpton? Was she your first crush maybe?

I think Jean Shrimpton is one of the most beautiful women to ever walks God’s earth. A true mesmeriser!

++ Out of curiosity, Mike McGrother, who plays the fiddle on Jean Shrimpton, does he have anything to do with the great Kevin McGrother?

Yes, it’s Kevin’s brother. He’s a brilliant fiddle player and fronts his own Poguesy type band The Wildcats Of Kilkenny. They’re big news round our way!

++ And what about Mascara Dave? What’s the story behind him?

Mascara Dave is a fictional goth character, and a friend of Abby. It’s a love song to cheap make-up and those brave enough to wear it round Stockton!

++ On “Come on Home” you invite all your favourite people to visit you. Among them you invite Ferdinand and Scholes… and even Cantona, so I guess you are a Manchester United fan? You do know they are not a favourite team for popkids? Who do you think will win the Premier League this year then?

Ferdinand and Scholes get a name check as they played together for England. Cantona is an enigma first and a footballer second- it’s the enigma that intrigues me. The Man Utd connection isn’t relevant. To be honest, I’m not a massive footie fan these days. Money has ruined the game and sucked all the goodness out. Who’ll win the title? Any of the usual suspects- it’s all so terribly predictable.

++ And, what about Louis Theroux?!

Another of life’s oddballs. I’m drawn to them every time.

++ It seems you had a great time with this band, so why didn’t you continue with the Close-Ups?

You’ve probably gathered by now Roque, I’m rather restless musically! There wasn’t anything left to do with The Close-Ups, and besides, I was ready to go live again. Hence what I’m doing now- Head Of Light Entertainment.
www.myspace.com/headoflightentertainment

++ Anything else you’d like to say?

Yeah, please buy the debut Head Of Light Entertainment album “I Am Liberated” on Northern Round Square Records, out in November! It brings the Whirlpool Guest House, Shandy Wildtyme and Close-Ups story bang up to date! Thanks Roque.
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Listen
The Close-Ups – 20,000 Groups

Thanks so much to Nick Fuller for the great interview! Please be sure to check the I Think of the Sea compilation that includes most of the recorded output by Almost Charlotte. You can get it at the Moments of Pleasure website.

++ Almost Charlotte starts as a three-piece and then later it expands to a full five-piece. How did you all meet? And how did this change in the line-up affected the band? Were the songs very different now? I ask especially because Matthew came in to add vocals and guitars! That must have changed a lot what Ian, Anthony and Bill were doing, right?

The original three piece (Ian Phillipson, Anthony Squires and Bill Russell) had all known each other for ages but they were looking to bring in a singer and they met Matthew through work. They were then looking for a drummer and, I think, advertised locally; I’d just moved to Brighton and replied to the ad. I think that Matthew joining certainly changed things because it gave us two quite different writers (Matthew and Ian). They were looking for a drummer to replace the machine that they were using in order to add some ‘light and shade’ so I hope that both additions moved things on. Certainly when we started to introduce more of Matthew’s songs the band’s overall sound changed quite a lot; the best period was really when we had a good mix of both writers’ stuff because I think that they were both strong in different ways.

++ Where does the name Almost Charlotte comes from?

Good question. I always took it to be a reference to The Cure’s ‘Charlotte Sometimes’ but I asked when I joined and I’m not sure I ever got a definitive answer!

++ Why did you decide to self-release your single? Was it easy to set up the Moments of Pleasure label?

I think we all believed in the indie ethic (and still do.) If the truth be told too we probably felt that we were only likely to sell a modest number locally and at our gigs so we didn’t really need to go cap in hand to a label especially as they were likely to tell us to get lost! It was pretty straightforward to set it up as long as you accepted that there wouldn’t be any national distribution and you were happy to do the leg work of pestering people to stock it/play it. We did both.

++ You recorded the single with Terry Popple from Van Morrison. How was working with him? What do you remember from this recording session? Any anecdotes you can share with me?

Terry was a good bloke and had a succession of Brighton bands in his studio at that time. We used to laugh that he was quite diplomatic in that, after a certain take, he’d say ‘that’s good – we’ll use it’ when he clearly meant ‘that’s as good as it’s going to get given that you lot can only just play your instruments!’ Diplomacy at its best. We weren’t offended. I’m not sure how his personal taste was but I’ve always been fascinated by the fact that people in the music biz (studio’s , promoters, labels) all have to sometimes work on such a range of stuff that they almost have to put their tastes aside. At that time there were a few C86 type bands around Brighton but there was also a thrash scene beginning to emerge so I’m sure that he’d have had his share of that stuff too which was hardly Van The Man.

++ I read on the Leamington Spa compilation that there were a couple of major label conversations after the single was released. What happened with that? Why didn’t that come through?

Text book stories really. We had a call from Chrysalis records once saying that they really liked the single and inviting us to go and see them with some other material. When we got there they didn’t really know who we were and weren’t much interested in our new stuff. That was a good example of how it was – and probably still is.

++ Why do you think the “break” never happened?

We were just one of a million bands really. We weren’t consistent enough and I do think that we changed so much in a short time that we’d have been a bit of a nightmare for anyone to catgeorise. The shift in people inside the band just meant that the songs changed – after Bill Russell left we had two other guitarists come and go and both (particularly Gwyn Carwardine) were very different. It was a bit unrealistic for us to expect the audience to change with us especially when some of the later developments were – er – pretty bad! I don’t get much pride from listening to the last stuff we did before calling it a day – it sounds directionless which it was.

++ On the “I Think of the Sea” compilation, you include 8 songs from your repertoire. One of them appeared on the single. What about the other 7? When and where were these recorded? Are these, plus the single, all the songs ever recorded by the band, or are there any more demo tapes lying around?

ITOTS is a compilation of the stuff that I thought represented what we did most accurately. It’s not necessarily always the best but it does sum up the band overall. For instance there are some live tracks on there that were very roughly recorded by hanging a mic off the ceiling above the stage; these were from the first gig I ever played with the band and I didn’t know the songs so I kept playing v steady (rather like the drum machine I was supposed to be replacing) so that I didn’t do something ambitious in the wrong place! Nevertheless those songs – warts and all – are a pretty good reflection of what the band was like live then. I clearly remember my first gig with them in a really crowded pub with people dancing on the tables to this pretty messy noise that we were making – it was great. ‘Sleep’ was chosen as the single because we all thought that it was an example of the next chapter – as a song it was a lot more complete and structured than most and we felt that it was a sign of where we were going. Most of the studio stuff was recorded with Terry Popple although we did do a session with the legendary Grant @ La Di Da. There are other demo’s on tape that haven’t been digitised – they’re of variable quality both in terms of the strength of the songs and the recording process.

++ Did you gig a lot? What gigs do you remember the most and why?

A fair amount. There was a kind of hierarchy then and we were always some way down it. The Popguns were at the top – quite rightly as they were brilliant. We weren’t seen as being in their league so we played lesser venues but, for all that, we enjoyed it and had a consistent following whose support we always appreciated. London gigs always gave us a bit of a boost but far and away the best for me was a support slot to The Band of Holy Joy. At the time they were the darlings of the indie press so getting the slot – and at the Escape club which was one of the best – was a result in itself. On the night we were desperate to put on a good show as it was a big crowd most of which didn’t know us. We played really well and came off the stage feeling great. A few people came up and said how much they liked it and asked us when we were playing next as they’d definitely come. The next gig though was that same old crowd. This again is a standard story for so many bands. It’s so hard to build momentum. I’m not complaining though – it was a great night and I’m still listening to Holy Joy’s stuff today.

++ Your single seems very rare, hard to come by. So I’m wondering how many copies were pressed? I really hope finding one soon!

I think we did 1000. As I said we never expected to sell them outside of gigs and local shops. We certainly didn’t sell the lot at the time and until a couple of years ago I still had some old copies in my loft. What happened though was that, somehow, it got picked up by some indie fans in Japan and became collectible which is why people now know about it. Two of the three tracks are now available on CD (one on Leamington Spa and one on I Think Of The Sea) but I doubt that any more copies of the original single will surface.

++ Among the titles of your songs I find “Moments of Pleasure” and “Too Cold for Comfort”, two titles that kind of antagonize each other. Then there’s “Hope” and “Sleep”, so I have to ask, what was the inspiration and creative process for Almost Charlotte?

That’s not easy to answer. Ian’s early songs were certainly melancholic and Matthew’s often had a more jangly pop angle although not lyrically. The route of our problem was probably that we weren’t very good at melding the two together so instead of taking the best of both we sometimes ended up clashing in the middle. In some bands that friction is really productive but in many it isn’t and I don’t think it ultimately was with us. I think that Ian wrote some really good stuff and was more accomplished than he gave himself credit for and I’ve always liked Matthew’s stuff – I’m still writing with him today.

++ Why did you call it a day with Almost Charlotte?

A collective tiredness really. We’d changed so much in three years and felt that we’d improved, become more ambitious and worthy of attention. We didn’t get any though; we felt that we’d not really seen any progress in terms of gigs/audiences/interest so I don’t think we had the appetite for anymore. A pretty familiar story.

++ What do you think was the biggest highlight of the band?

For me it was The Band Of Holy Joy gig and the day that I saw our single in the window of the legendary Rounder Records shop in Brighton! It is though undeniably nice to still know that people have an interest in us for a single that came out 20 years ago.

++ What did you do after Almost Charlotte? Are you still in touch with the other Almost Charlotte members? What do you dedicate your time nowadays aside from music?

Matthew and I got together with another couple of Brighton musicians to form Bluff which ran for a couple of years and ten of its songs also appear on I Think Of The Sea. Nowadays, Matthew and I still do some sporadic stuff as Rogue Beauty (www.wwwroguebeautycom.moonfruit.com) and I write too (I’ve done a couple of books including www.callmebud.com) I think that Ian is playing and writing music too. Some of us are still in touch occasionally through the magic of Facebook (!) but it’s been a very long time since we all met up.

++ Do you still live in Brighton? Has it changed much? What were your favourite Brighton bands from back in the day? oh! and which is your favourite beach in Brighton?

I don’t but I still get back there. It has changed a lot but it’s still a very vibrant place for all of the arts including music so it’s always great to go back there. Brighton band #1 has to be The Popguns but I also liked HBM5. As for beaches there’s really only one and it’s OK but the best thing about the place is more the vibe than the pebbles!

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Listen

Almost Charlotte – Frustration